Some people just don't know when to shut up, do they?

[Numbski]

Okay, XBL has it's fair share of trash talk. Really.

I ran into a guy online I've never heard of before. His gamertag is Treygo. Say hello Treygo.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1051/1217639788_205c857acc.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/numbski/1217639788

Treygo likes to run his mouth. What started this was playing against him today. I got the ball first, drove him back to about his own 40, and then punted. Stuck him on his own goal line with the punt. I mean perfect. He decided to pass three downs in a row. Safety. I get two points, his punts off to me.

I run the ball. And run. Pass a few times. I decided to get cute and did one of those end-around-reverse play action pass deals. Shouldn't have gotten cute. Picks it off and runs it back. TD. So he's winning 7-2. He kicks off to me. So now we're into the second quarter, and he's run all of three plays. I drove on him and ran it in. The first half ends 9-7, me winning, and he's literally had the ball for a few seconds.

Going into the second half, he gets the ball first, and actually gets to run his offense. Novel concept. His offense is really simple - he has two stars on offense, Christian Okoye, and Mike Ditka. His gameplan is simple. Seam pass to Ditka. He's not open? Scramble. Throw to him anyway. Repeat. The problem with this game plan is that it was WORKING. Ditka was pulling it down in triple coverage. Grrr....

I sent him a message to the effect that if he didn't knock it off and start playing right, I'd rate him down for it. He wrote me back telling me "Cry", and "Quit Crybaby".

Ooooohkay. Well, needless to say he went in with it that drive. He's up now 14-9. He kicks off to me. Hmmm....

So he wants to throw to Ditka, who pulls the ball down out of triple coverage? What's the best way to stop that? I know! You can't throw the ball when you don't have the ball to begin with. :D

I limited my playbook to plays that went no longer than 3-5 yards the rest of the game. He got the ball one last time near the end of the 4th quarter, me winning 15-14 ( went for 2 to make it a full field goal and failed), and I blitzed the crap out of him and picked him off. I ran the ball some more, took a knee.

He had the gall to msg me after the game to say "All that crying, and I held you with me D."

O RLY???? :D

Well then sir, I salute you. You really stopped me and my Crusaders from walking all over you my friend:

14 first downs vs. his 3.
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1409/1217639208_b04b7df4a7.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/numbski/1217639208

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1038/1217638668_235457def2.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/numbski/1217638668

This one really says it all:
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1149/1216770337_eae0fe6ac0.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/numbski/1216770337

I think it was Phillip A Bole that likes to run on about how I run a ball control offense. Apparently so. :D


http://www.flickr.com/photos/numbski/archives/date-posted/2007/08/23/

[omerta07]

His offense is really simple - he has two stars on offense, Christian Okoye, and Mike Ditka. His gameplan is simple. Seam pass to Ditka. He's not open? Scramble. Throw to him anyway. Repeat. The problem with this game plan is that it was WORKING. Ditka was pulling it down in triple coverage. Grrr....

I sent him a message to the effect that if he didn't knock it off and start playing right, I'd rate him down for it. He wrote me back telling me "Cry", and "Quit Crybaby".

how was he not "playing right" ?

[dj Live]

17 minutes to his 2, thats crazy !!! I've had ball control games but nothing like that.....

[Numbski]

how was he not "playing right" ?

Please tell me you're not so dense as to pretend there is nothing wrong with running the same 2 plays over and over again, throwing into triple coverage and getting away with it...

[killamanjaro]

Come on Numbski you know you're going to get slammed because you couldn't stop a play that was too effective by our Sportsmanlike counterparts.

[hooman1844]

I used to have the same problem, but not anymore. Sure they catch some lame ones, but I doubled Ditka with a linebacker and once he's about to catch it, switch over to a defender near the ball and spike it down. Increases your defensive abilities tenfold.

[lockupkeeper]

Numbski, You sound like a true cry-baby....You got an Issue, Go get some tissue!!! He pass the Ball to Ditka and you"re Mad because he Kept DOING IT??!!! So What!!! You should be at yourself for not being able to beat it...Give him a Bad rating for Passing the ball to Ditka..Give yourself a bad rating for not Being smart Enough to stop it!!! lol

[lockupkeeper]

This guy gave me a Bad rating in NBA2K7, Because he thought I reached too much...I beat him, And he was just Mad--Because he got out-played, Plain and Simple

[lockupkeeper]

Go Check Your Man Card....lol

[Numbski]

Um......really?

That's funny. I've never played the game. EVER. I don't own it. Heck, I don't even *like* basketball.

[Numbski]

I used to have the same problem, but not anymore. Sure they catch some lame ones, but I doubled Ditka with a linebacker and once he's about to catch it, switch over to a defender near the ball and spike it down. Increases your defensive abilities tenfold.

I did try man. I had him doubled with Rod Woodson and Richard Butkus, and manually brought Charlie Waters. No good. I'd miss batting it down. Easiest thing to do (that worked) was to tackle Ditka when the ball was snapped and take the holding call. :) If you do it before he gets across the line of scrimmage, it isn't holding. Cheap, but no worse than what he was doing. :P

[General308]

One question if he only had three first downs the whole game how was his game plan working?

[metallicatz]

Numbski, You sound like a true cry-baby....You got an Issue, Go get some tissue!!! He pass the Ball to Ditka and you"re Mad because he Kept DOING IT??!!! So What!!! You should be at yourself for not being able to beat it...Give him a Bad rating for Passing the ball to Ditka..Give yourself a bad rating for not Being smart Enough to stop it!!! lol


Spoken like a true cheeser. Tell me, when was the last time you saw Trent Green throw to Gonzalez the way this player did in his game? Never, that's when. When was the last time you saw Brees or Rivers throw to Gates that way? Never, that's when. When you have only two stars on offense (QB and TE) and simply work the ball between the two of them over and over.............It's cheese. But I don't blame the cheeser so much as I blame 2K Sports for catering to the minority online crowd with a totally arcade mechanic such as the star player/legend system. It's totally funny to me now considering all the flak the minority online guys gave the franchise guys for not jumping on the bandwagon blindfolded, and now half the threads I see are the very same people complaining about cheesers online. Be careful what you wish for. And whenever I doubt my decision to stay away from online play (due to my own experience with online trash) all I have to do is take a quick glance at this board for affirmation.

[hooman1844]

I did try man. I had him doubled with Rod Woodson and Richard Butkus, and manually brought Charlie Waters. No good. I'd miss batting it down. Easiest thing to do (that worked) was to tackle Ditka when the ball was snapped and take the holding call. :) If you do it before he gets across the line of scrimmage, it isn't holding. Cheap, but no worse than what he was doing. :P
I don't know what to tell you then. I know that legend TE's, Ditka especially, catch just about anything in single coverage, but when I double him and then manually switch and smack it down the moment before it reaches his hands, that usually works. When I say manually do it, I mean manually switch when the ball's about to land, when the ai puts the player in position. Manually chasing him down never works for me because, well, I guess I'm just bad at that.

[BillyAssman]

Try manually controlling the FS and gettin a jump on the ball when he does it. Rien Pagel is a BEAST. I love the generic dudes.

[lockupkeeper]

I'm not a cheeser-- I have a 91% feedback rating, Maybe, the guy just suck!!! I just hate to hear people cry with something that is so petty...You give him a bad rating, Because you can't stop Ditka from catching the Ball?? I think that's Pathetic----If you want people to play the way you PLAY, You shouldn't be playing online...Stop Complanin

[Numbski]

I'm not a cheeser-- I have a 91% feedback rating, Maybe, the guy just suck!!! I just hate to hear people cry with something that is so petty...You give him a bad rating, Because you can't stop Ditka from catching the Ball?? I think that's Pathetic----If you want people to play the way you PLAY, You shouldn't be playing online...Stop Complanin

Whatever man. We'll have to agree to disagree on this. I don't see how you think it's okay to exploit something like that. I bring two golds and a bronze to stop him, and he still pulls it in? :\

[omerta07]

Numbski, You sound like a true cry-baby....You got an Issue, Go get some tissue!!! He pass the Ball to Ditka and you"re Mad because he Kept DOING IT??!!! So What!!! You should be at yourself for not being able to beat it...Give him a Bad rating for Passing the ball to Ditka..Give yourself a bad rating for not Being smart Enough to stop it!!! lol
thank you .

[omerta07]

Spoken like a true cheeser. Tell me, when was the last time you saw Trent Green throw to Gonzalez the way this player did in his game? Never, that's when. When was the last time you saw Brees or Rivers throw to Gates that way? Never, that's when. When you have only two stars on offense (QB and TE) and simply work the ball between the two of them over and over.............It's cheese. But I don't blame the cheeser so much as I blame 2K Sports for catering to the minority online crowd with a totally arcade mechanic such as the star player/legend system. It's totally funny to me now considering all the flak the minority online guys gave the franchise guys for not jumping on the bandwagon blindfolded, and now half the threads I see are the very same people complaining about cheesers online. Be careful what you wish for. And whenever I doubt my decision to stay away from online play (due to my own experience with online trash) all I have to do is take a quick glance at this board for affirmation.
staying with a play that is working is cheese ? thats it im done with this thread .

[omerta07]

Whatever man. We'll have to agree to disagree on this. I don't see how you think it's okay to exploit something like that. I bring two golds and a bronze to stop him, and he still pulls it in? :\
yeah , lord knows weve never seen anyone catch a ball in triple coverage .

[Numbski]

yeah , lord knows weve never seen anyone consistently catch a ball in triple coverage .

There, I fixed it for you.

[butterknife26]

You're the one who's the crybaby. I would run the same plays too if you can't stop it. Stop *****ing!

[General308]

There, I fixed it for you.


He had three first downs in the whole game how was he doing it on every play?

[omerta07]

You're the one who's the crybaby. I would run the same plays too if you can't stop it. Stop *****ing!
exactly !!! some of these guys are ridiculous .

[omerta07]

He had three first downs in the whole game how was he doing it on every play?
i think we all can see now that this guy is a fraud .

[Numbski]

"this guy"?

Wow. I'm speechless. How was he doing it on every play? It's pretty simple. He still ran plays. He completed the ones he ran. I simply made sure he didn't run anymore. He would have kept on doing it had I given him the chance.

Just a note - calling a moderator a fraud won't earn you brownie points around here.

[soleshark]

Not to knock what numbski is saying because those type of games are boring!!!
as far as his playing style goes, if the guy wants to pass every down & throw to the
same wr~ te ect!! that his right to do so. you should have adjusted your defense to stop that.

Had a game the other day, the guy had barry sanders( whom i never have problems with)
ran the same run play over and over and over, carved me up for 258 yards~ he propably
threw the ball 3 times!!!!

i finally adjusted my defense and stop his play on his last 2 drives & won by a touchdown,
but i didn't give the guy a negative, he did what worked till i stopped it!!

[puMa tic]

He would have kept on doing it had I given him the chance.

Wow, go figure.

[Numbski]

My gripe with it is pretty simple though - the only thing I could do to stop him was tackle the TE before he got off the line, and then bleed the clock dry. That makes me as bad as him in that case, which I don't appreciate. I "did what worked".

I think we can both agree that neither of us did what would be considered playing football "normally". I go online to play simulation, cranial, "chess-like" football. When I play against people that are very much one-trick ponies, it makes me angry because it wastes my time. Either I can't find a way to stop it (which means I get the waste the next hour seeing the same thing over and over again, each time wanting to smash my controller), or I do, and the game is BORING, as you say.

I think I'm seeing a need to be able to tag yourself by desired playstyle - arcade or sim. If you want to just "do what works" over and over again, by all means - slap the arcade tag on yourself and play others with a like mindset. If you want to play the way I do, slap the sim tag on yourself. The only issue I see there is people slapping sim on and then griefing people by pulling this crap anyway.

[Numbski]

Wow, go figure.

I don't know who put the sign on this thread that said it was acceptable to gang up on me in here....and I'm not going to be childish and start handing out bans, however I'm wondering when this place got overrun with people that think cheesing others is perfectly acceptable placing normal players in the minority.

When did this happen, and why didn't I get the memo? 2 months ago you guys would have been laughed right off of this board...

[The_Gamefather]

Numbski, that's how online goes. If you don't like it, then either pay somebody to play your way, or play the CPU. Really, that's all you can do.

[GhostRider]

Please tell me you're not so dense as to pretend there is nothing wrong with running the same 2 plays over and over again, throwing into triple coverage and getting away with it...

No, it is a stupid style, but you have to give him SOME credit for being able to make completions in triple coverage......sounds like he has talent, just no Football sense

[GhostRider]

My gripe with it is pretty simple though - the only thing I could do to stop him was tackle the TE before he got off the line, and then bleed the clock dry. That makes me as bad as him in that case, which I don't appreciate. I "did what worked".

I think we can both agree that neither of us did what would be considered playing football "normally". I go online to play simulation, cranial, "chess-like" football. When I play against people that are very much one-trick ponies, it makes me angry because it wastes my time. Either I can't find a way to stop it (which means I get the waste the next hour seeing the same thing over and over again, each time wanting to smash my controller), or I do, and the game is BORING, as you say.

I think I'm seeing a need to be able to tag yourself by desired playstyle - arcade or sim. If you want to just "do what works" over and over again, by all means - slap the arcade tag on yourself and play others with a like mindset. If you want to play the way I do, slap the sim tag on yourself. The only issue I see there is people slapping sim on and then griefing people by pulling this crap anyway.

WEll, I sure agree about the annoying styles some people have...although hurry ups aren't really all that cheesy in 5 minute quarters....

[totalownership]

I've said it before, I'll say it again. Aside from the different lobbies that 2K have online they need an "Arcade/Action" lobby and a "Sim" lobby. If you play in the sim knowing FULL WELL there's an arcade/action lobby that you should be playing in then enough feedback from sim players in positive feedback should warrant a warning from 2K to get your behind in arcade, even more warnings and a little 2K lobby "time out" is in order.

Ok that being said, sometimes you only have a few styles of play that you can see according to someone's defense or offense. I've played games where the whole game I can see that the guy has decided for himself that he'll let me get all the passes I want but he's not going to let me get one yard on the ground. So why waste a down? I'll run a little here and there just to keep him looking but I'm going to air it out, and vice versa.

Numbski you already solved the problem though. If doubling wont help on a particular offensive threat then your last resort is to chuck dude at the line and throw his timing off. I don't know about full out tackling but chuck dude does work.

I don't know how the game went down but I do know that sometimes a guy's defense is so good or your guys are playing so sh**y that you are forced to one or two "money" plays while you try to find something else and in 5 minute Q's you don't have much time to find that something else. I'm slow, lol, so it usually takes me till the next half to adjust. I had one game where the only guy making a play for me was Rob Moore. My silver reciever couldn't catch a cold if you sneezed in his face. My TE was getting "man-dated" all up and down the field and my run was non-existent. Couldn't run ANYTHING AT ALL. The only guy that had my back was Rob and some generic as long as he was WIIIIIIIIIIDE open and I laid it in there soft. So I had to run like that for nearly the whole 2nd half till the other guys got their groove back but they were killing me and I just had to get away from them.

[Hotsuma]

do you know why he makes catches in triple coverage.. EQ OFF.. same **** that worked in nfl2k5 eq off games.. work in this game..

EQ is the answer my friend


but wait.. you cant play ranked games with EQ on.. way to go 2k..

[totalownership]

I forgot my "closing statement". LOL, I got distracted.

But if a guy is coming into a game and out the box is just launching one or two plays and not even trying anything else then that is wack. It's not fun at all. I feel like I just wasted those minutes because I haven't learned anything and the guy didn't make me any better except at stopping one particular play.

[Numbski]

That's what he did. He ran 2 plays the entire game. Granted, he only had the ball for 2 minutes in total, but still.

[Phenomegirl]

I don't know who put the sign on this thread that said it was acceptable to gang up on me in here....and I'm not going to be childish and start handing out bans, however I'm wondering when this place got overrun with people that think cheesing others is perfectly acceptable placing normal players in the minority.

When did this happen, and why didn't I get the memo? 2 months ago you guys would have been laughed right off of this board...

I got the memo when I realized that people (even people with high feedback) don't even know how to be good sports (win or lose) and do simple things like take a knee when appropriate, etc.

Too much ritalin in our society now. If Einstein was born in today's world, we would classify him as "special needs" and put him on ritalin.

[General308]

That's what he did. He ran 2 plays the entire game. Granted, he only had the ball for 2 minutes in total, but still.


Here is my problem. You are complaining he was throwing in to triple coverage. Ok so what. It is a dumb thing to do. But he had what 60 yards passing so the strategy clearly wasn't working. His touch down was because of a turnover. So again why are you complaining his strategy was working. When looking at the stats it shows clear as day it wasn't working.

Now you don't have to like his style of play. But you are acting like he was taking advantage of you. But if you look at the stats you posted you can see that isn't the case. He had a total of 3 first downs. So clearly he wasn't getting first downs on these plays you are complaining about. His touch down was off a turnover. So he scored cause of your mistake. So what I am asking is was he really that bad? Or do you think you might be overreacting a bit based on these stats.

[namhnit]

Lol Numbski. I just played a guy who would throw to Ditka all the time. He beat me by a touchdown. Checked the stats, Ditka had 9 Recs and he was thrown to 13 times.

You guys can say Numbski is crying and all, but I understand his point. There's a certain integrity you have to keep when you play this game. Obviously, throwing into triple coverage is not a good idea and his opponent still kept doing it, with success as well. How is that football? Play the game right and you won't get disrespected amongst your peers is all I'm trying to say.

[General308]

Lol Numbski. I just played a guy who would throw to Ditka all the time. He beat me by a touchdown. Checked the stats, Ditka had 9 Recs and he was thrown to 13 times.

You guys can say Numbski is crying and all, but I understand his point. There's a certain integrity you have to keep when you play this game. Obviously, throwing into triple coverage is not a good idea and his opponent still kept doing it, with success as well. How is that football? Play the game right and you won't get disrespected amongst your peers is all I'm trying to say.


If his opponent was doing it with success over and over again. Explain to me why he had almost no passing yards. Only 3 first downs and got his only score off a turnover. The numbers are not adding up.

[Numbski]

That's not true at all. He got his *first* score off of a turnover. He got his second score lobbing to Ditka in triple coverage.

[Numbski]

Here is my problem. You are complaining he was throwing in to triple coverage. Ok so what. It is a dumb thing to do. But he had what 60 yards passing so the strategy clearly wasn't working. His touch down was because of a turnover. So again why are you complaining his strategy was working. When looking at the stats it shows clear as day it wasn't working.

Now you don't have to like his style of play. But you are acting like he was taking advantage of you. But if you look at the stats you posted you can see that isn't the case. He had a total of 3 first downs. So clearly he wasn't getting first downs on these plays you are complaining about. His touch down was off a turnover. So he scored cause of your mistake. So what I am asking is was he really that bad? Or do you think you might be overreacting a bit based on these stats.

I think you missed the part where he scored two TD's, one lobbing to Ditka, the other off a turnover. He didn't do more damage because I didn't let him go on offense again. It most certainly was effective. He drove 60 yards lobbing to Ditka in triple coverage all the way. How is that *not* effective precisely?

[TalibanAction]

Numbski, I for one agree with you. I mean, I'm a grown man and I play for fun. These boards have scared me off from playing APF online b/c of all the cheesing talk. The ONE reason I play Madden online (yes, I know - I'm playing with fire on these boards saying this and the Anti-Christ game online) is b/c if you throw into triple coverage on there YOU WILL PAY IMMEDIATELY. TO (as in turnover for those who didn't know). I mean, I really shouldn't have to come online and check forums to prepare myself to play against BS glitches and cheese and whatever you guys call this classless play. I've played, coached, watched and grew up around enough football to know how to translate it to a game. If the game is true to the sport (Disclaimer: APF is the 3 greatest sports game ever behind NFL 2K5 and NBA 2K7 respectively), then I shouldn't have to worry about players catching the ball in triple coverage.

And NO, I haven't seen anyone catch passes in triple coverage in any sport consistently in my entire life. Or on Youtube :)

[GreyHoundSteve]

Numb, these guys arent exclusive to XBL. They are also about the ONLY type of player on PS3 as well. I played 3 games last night and NOT ONE person punted even though they should have MANY times. But why punt when you have so many "money plays"?

2 play offenses would be a welcome vs the guys i played last night. Try one play (the fleaflicker) from Marino to Rice every play (solid color uniforms that blend into the turf too, yay). Lots of fun i assure you. Then i played the Cunningham, Campbell, Rice combo. These guys have two plays, the Earl Iso and the deep Rice or Scramble if he is covered (rarely happens). Of course all 3 guys i played use no huddle EVERY chance they get because once they see how you stopped their one play they simply no huddle and run the other, you audible, then they audible too until they finally adible to the play that doesnt fit your defense (now thats REAL football alright ((roll)) ).

Im sorry to say but my opinion of this game and most of its players is pure garbage.

I spent the first several weeks playing JUST guys i knew from 2k5 and i thought the game was lacking but addequate. I stepped outside of the 4 guys i knew played sim and EVERYONE else i have played just uses exploits and i cant say i blame them since there are more exploits than their are ways to stop them and if you release a game this pooly programmed (worse than madden imo) when you have to expect the cheesers will run with it. For comparison sake imagine the worst room of Socom glitchers you could assemble, now you have an online 2k8 game. Its nothing but people who wont run a SINGLE legit play because they know if they use their money play 4 times in a row it will move the sticks 95% of the time. This isnt "he uses the pats so he has an unfair advantage", this is 100 times worse and makes the game unplayable online vs anyone you dont know.

Legends may have sounded like a good idea but if you cant program LEGENDS TO STOP LEGENDS then they shouldnt have used them at all. Vc obvously coundnt do this, and didnt care. 2k5's programming was light years ahead of this 2kmadden attempt.

I have been playing 2k games since the FIRST 2k on DC and this game has so many exploits that it imbarreses me to have been a 2k fan all of these years.

"Money players and money plays EVERY DOWN, YIPPY!" Boo 2k!!

IMO 2k lost its identity by releasing this game the way it is and i think the sales numbers reflect how most people feel about 2k5 vs this turd of a game.

[Dammstraight]

I thought that this message board wouldnt allow this kind of crap ie complaining about others and standing them out with pics to boot! Numbski we all play guys that are annoying, and it fries me when a guy no matter how unfootball saavy he is, keeps on playing the same play and its working . . .. but too call him out well that doesnt make you much better either. You won the game that should be congratulations enuf! congrats on your time of possession i dont think i have ever seen that before!

[Dammstraight]

tripe coverage aside just like in real football stranger things happen. And as you prob wont come across a player who constantly passes to mike ditka in triple coverage and is constantly hitting him like you did. it gives credence that this is the best sim out there. Sometimes as much as you would like things dont go your way. that said if it happens consistently in APF where triple teamed players always catch the ball then i will not call this the best football sim ever . . . but i havent proven otherwise yet.

[GreyHoundSteve]

tripe coverage aside just like in real football stranger things happen. And as you prob wont come across a player who constantly passes to mike ditka in triple coverage and is constantly hitting him like you did. it gives credence that this is the best sim out there. Sometimes as much as you would like things dont go your way. that said if it happens consistently in APF where triple teamed players always catch the ball then i will not call this the best football sim ever . . . but i havent proven otherwise yet.

If you think this is the best football sim out there then you didnt play 2k5, or 2k4 or even 2k3. This game is madden is a 2k dress.

I dont bother double covering anyone anymore because it doesnt matter. You can double Rod Woodson and Lem Barney on Rice and he will leap over top both of them, run right past both of them and out route both of them. Simply put, this is an offensive money play game with money player combos.

At least back in 2k3 you could single cover Rice and time the hit and make him drop a few. Theres NOTHING you can do against him or Ditka or a few others when the person your playing is content on getting them the ball regardless of the coverage they can do it, kind of like that other football game.

[ToyDingo]

Theres NOTHING you can do against him or Ditka or a few others when the person your playing is content on getting them the ball regardless of the coverage they can do it, kind of like that other football game.

Have someone like Browner cover Rice. Browner has the footsteps and big hit ability. As soon as Rice touches the ball...nail him. He'll drop it about 25% of the time. Works for me...:)

[Numbski]

It's sad. I'm a big St. Louis Rams fan. The Rams have more or less always had a great passing offense and so-so defense. This game - it's sad, but I've given up on balance and stacked my defense, but it doesn't seem to matter. My play calling simply can't be *that* bad. I've played quite a bit of football (ie, put on the pads and go hit people), and played far more videogame football than I care to admit. I have to agree that there are balance issues that MUST be addressed if this series is to continue.

I recall running into similar problems in 2K5, but nothing this severe. I don't think I'd call it 2KMadden, but the balance is all out of whack. In 2K5, I knew Bruce and Holt were excellent receivers, but I had no qualms about tossing the ball to my Fullback, tight ends, or number 3, and number 4 wideouts. This game tends to be real crapshoot when you give the ball to a non-legend. Sometimes they do great, other times, you couldn't toss the ball to them covered in super glue and get them to catch it. Meanwhile tossing the bomb to Jerry Rice is a gimme. Sad.

I'm not going to claim game balancing is an easy thing - it isn't. The benefit 2K5 had was that they had years of previous data to draw from balancing one player from another. They basically had to go back to the drawing board on game balance and unfortunately it shows. I don't think the devs were aiming for arcade football, I think it's simply a lack of useful data to properly balance things out. I sincerely hope the game hangs around long enough to improve.

I will say that this game must be FAR worse than it is now for me to even consider playing Madden.

[totalownership]

What level are you guys playing on? Reason I ask is i'm not having anyone **** me as bad as you guys are saying. I just don't know, and I know I'm not that good. Maybe I'm playing some scrubs or something but I've played a nice balance of people with all kinds of ratings and I've never had somebody just run the same play over and over even when I know it's coming. I try to stay in Legend lobby though. I notice All-Pro is a bit outta wack for me.

[omerta07]

I think you missed the part where he scored two TD's, one lobbing to Ditka, the other off a turnover. He didn't do more damage because I didn't let him go on offense again. It most certainly was effective. He drove 60 yards lobbing to Ditka in triple coverage all the way. How is that *not* effective precisely?
dude just admit that you were caught downright lying . now youre saying the ditka crap was all in 1 drive , that means that you had an ENTIRE game to try and make adjustments but you didnt you just instantly started *****ing and crying . you are a cry baby dawg , you are . i had similar problems with jay novacek and while i dont want to share my adjustments to make you better i will say by the 3rd quarter i found a great [ and not too hard to figure ] solution for him . i lost the game in the end but cut jays production in half in the final 2 quarters , sent my opponent a friend invite after the game , played him the next day using my new gameplan for jay the entire game and won . that numbski is what football is all about .

[totalownership]

Hey numbski why don't you try to start up a forum league. I'd be down for that and we have quite a few people here who are known sim so I think that would be best.

[omerta07]

....and I'm not going to be childish and start handing out bans
for 1 thing no one has done ANYTHING to get banned so dont abuse your "power" . for another , if so ban yourself for altering my post earlier .

[omerta07]

sad thing is , besides clearly seeing that you are crying i dont necessarily disagree with what you are saying but your story has a million damn wholes in it . he did the same 2 plays "all game" . in 1 drive , for 2 minutes . he did the same lob pass to ditka sucessfully "all game". for 2 1st downs. numbski you adjusted to this guys "game" and you won . thats what football is all about and i commend you for strategizing and pulling the win out , but you should have left it on the field . we all have games like that everyday so this just wasnt worth the time .

[ScottyP]

It's sad. I'm a big St. Louis Rams fan. The Rams have more or less always had a great passing offense and so-so defense. This game - it's sad, but I've given up on balance and stacked my defense, but it doesn't seem to matter. My play calling simply can't be *that* bad. I've played quite a bit of football (ie, put on the pads and go hit people), and played far more videogame football than I care to admit. I have to agree that there are balance issues that MUST be addressed if this series is to continue.

I recall running into similar problems in 2K5, but nothing this severe. I don't think I'd call it 2KMadden, but the balance is all out of whack. In 2K5, I knew Bruce and Holt were excellent receivers, but I had no qualms about tossing the ball to my Fullback, tight ends, or number 3, and number 4 wideouts. This game tends to be real crapshoot when you give the ball to a non-legend. Sometimes they do great, other times, you couldn't toss the ball to them covered in super glue and get them to catch it. Meanwhile tossing the bomb to Jerry Rice is a gimme. Sad.

I'm not going to claim game balancing is an easy thing - it isn't. The benefit 2K5 had was that they had years of previous data to draw from balancing one player from another. They basically had to go back to the drawing board on game balance and unfortunately it shows. I don't think the devs were aiming for arcade football, I think it's simply a lack of useful data to properly balance things out. I sincerely hope the game hangs around long enough to improve.

I will say that this game must be FAR worse than it is now for me to even consider playing Madden.

This is EXACTLY how I feel. The generic guys are all over the place. Some will catch it damn near every time while others will drop it almost every time. There HAS to be some way to give us an idea of the quality of player we are tossing the ball to.

If players felt more comfortable throwing or running the ball with a generic, I think we'd see more plays go their way. As it is, I throw to my legend receivers because I can't trust anyone else to catch.

The problem is when people start abusing these legends because they can do everything too well.

I think 2K has made solid strides with the game and is headed in the right direction, but it needs a lot of massaging to make it really dialed in.

[Numbski]

Wow. Way to call the moderator a liar. Good job man. Really good. :/

[General308]

I think you missed the part where he scored two TD's, one lobbing to Ditka, the other off a turnover. He didn't do more damage because I didn't let him go on offense again. It most certainly was effective. He drove 60 yards lobbing to Ditka in triple coverage all the way. How is that *not* effective precisely?


Ok my mistake. He had one drive the whole game. So the guy had one drive and after that did nothing and because his one drive worked you felt the need to start a big thread because someone scored against you one time? I honestly just don't understand that. I mean if someone only had 3 first downs in the whole game I just don't see anything to complain about.

[Lacarious]

Hey numbski why don't you try to start up a forum league. I'd be down for that and we have quite a few people here who are known sim so I think that would be best.

he already did... not sure how it worked out though.

[GreyHoundSteve]

This is EXACTLY how I feel. The generic guys are all over the place. Some will catch it damn near every time while others will drop it almost every time. There HAS to be some way to give us an idea of the quality of player we are tossing the ball to.

If players felt more comfortable throwing or running the ball with a generic, I think we'd see more plays go their way. As it is, I throw to my legend receivers because I can't trust anyone else to catch.

The problem is when people start abusing these legends because they can do everything too well.

I think 2K has made solid strides with the game and is headed in the right direction, but it needs a lot of massaging to make it really dialed in.


I agree with you on everything except the legends part. That was the decision that sank the ship on this game. A completely fake league with players that were realistically proportionate to one another would have been the way to go with the 2k franchise. Or they simply could have just recreated all of the actual NFL players but with fake names and fake teams then had them all put on random teams (like the generics and legends controlled by the cpu in this game). Then it would have played like a TRUE 2K game instead of the arcade superman legend antics we have in this game.

But instead they went blitz/madden on us and sold the SIM FOOTBALL crowd down the river because we are the minority and VC just wanted to try and put more money in their pockets but the joke is on them because this game bombed and people didnt buy it and it effectively ended 2k football for ever.

The sad thing is that they could have released a 2k6 and 2k7 (FULL GAMES WITH FRANCHISE MODES and all the features 2k games use to have and now dont) the way i mentioned above and then by now EA would have probably abandoned the exclusive NFL deal because 2K would have been killing their sales without having to even have it and then we could have CELEBRATED 2K8; "The long awaited return of NFL football to the 2k series" but sadly instead we have this; an arcade blitz/madden with a bunch of guys we know little to nothing about except that they are better than the guys we know absolutely nothing about.

But hey, thats what good coaching is all about right? Not knowing jack squat about the players on your team makes for a great game, right? Lots of strategy can be employed then huh? ... What a joke!

Has anyone even bothered to really think about their team of WHO's? I mean i know my offensive lineman are "balanced" but are they fast, are they strong, are they agile, do they have good stamina, are all of them the EXACT SAME AS EACH OTHER or do ANY of these things even exist in this weak excuse for a 2k game?

I for one expected more out of them after a great game like 2k5 was, but instead we get a bar top game (like golden tee) where you drop in a quarter or two, pick a few "has been's" and call a bunch of silly plays (fleaflicker anyone) and watch the supermen you selected make unrealistic (ARCADE) plays. FANTASTIC! Thanks 2k for the big effort.

I got 2k5 for $20 and it was a REAL football game, i paid $60 for this thing and i'm still wondering where the rest of it is?

Thats my opinion at least and i hope SOMEONE at VC sees it.

[The_Gamefather]

I got 2k5 for $20 and it was a REAL football game, i paid $60 for this thing and i'm still wondering where the rest of it is?

Thats my opinion at least and i hope SOMEONE at VC sees it.

LOL You and me.