Swing Stick 2.0 Hitting Tips Inside

[vicarcaligulush]

SWING STICK 2.0 HITTING TIPS/HINTS GUIDE (Version 2.0)



:thumbsup: FIRST, KNOW THE TERMINOLOGY.

STEP is the initial step made which starts the stride.
STRIDE is the complete step from start to finish, before the swing.
Some batters have long strides. Others have short strides.

Therefore timing of your initial step (which starts the stride), will be different for players with different stride animations (more on this later).



:thumbsup: SECOND, A GENERAL RULE ABOUT STEP TIMING (AMENDED).

Good hitting means good step timing. And the key to good step timing means being able to recognize when the pitcher begins to make his move towards home.

GENERAL RULE: Time your step precisely when the pitcher makes his initial move towards home.

Generally, making his move towards home simply means that the pitcher physically is committed to throwing the ball home.

And making his move towards home can be recognized by any movement by the pitcher's body which suggests he is committed to throwing home.

It can be his body leaning towards home.
It can be his leg kick coming down towards home.
It can be his throwing arm moving towards home.

The key, and point is, any initial bodily movement towards home by the pitcher means he has committed to throw home. And when you initially see this, that's when you begin your step.

(NOTE: Recognizing when the pitcher makes his initial move home will generally result in perfect timing for your step.

However timing of your step will be slightly different when the pitcher is in the windup or in the set/stretch position, and when there are different types of pitching animations, because in these situations, the pitchers' body movements committing to throwing home will be different.

Also, slight modification to step timing will be made based on the individual batter's stride animation which will be explained later).

(AMENDMENT EXPLAINED: This section was amended from its original form because the previous points in the pitchers delivery which were used as benchmarks in guaging when to step, i.e., "just before release", although correct for particular pitchers, were not correct for other pitchers.

In simplifying this rule to help time step, more people will become more effective at timing step for any given pitcher with any given batter, due to the simplicity and broad reach of the rule emphasizing recognition of the pitcher's initial move home).



:thumbsup: THIRD, STEP TIMING CHANGES WHEN PITCHER PITCHES OUT OF STRETCH.

As already alluded to, when the pitcher pitches out of the stretch, you will still time your step when you see the pitcher initially make his move towards home.

However, because pitching out of the stretch usually means the pitcher gets the ball to the plate quicker, you will need to adjust your step to be slightly quicker/earlier than normal (pitcher's initial move towards home) FOR ALL BATTERS.



:thumbsup: FOURTH, RULES FOR DIFFERENT STRIDE ANIMATIONS/ILLUSTRATIONS.

Stride animations have an effect on step timing. I will use two players from my favorite team, the Indians, to illustrate.

Travis Hafner (DH) has a slightly longer than average stride. Therefore I need to time the step to be just a little earlier than normal (a little earlier than the pitcher's initial move towards home), because his stride animation takes longer.

RULE: If stride is longer than average, then step must be earlier than normal.

Compare Asdrubal Cabrera (2B) who has a much quicker than average stride. Therefore, the timing for the step has to come later than normal (a little later than the pitcher's initial move towards home), because his stride animation takes a shorter time than normal.

RULE: If stride is shorter than average, then step must be later than normal.



:thumbsup: FIFTH, TWO METHODS ON COMBINING STEP AND SWING.

There are two primary schools of thought/methods to hit with effective/efficient contact. They are:

Hold Cocked Back
Release To Rest

I will address each separately.


Hold Cocked Back
Pull back the right stick to start the step,
and HOLD IT COCKED BACK, before pushing forward to swing.

(The theory behind this method is that holding the stick cocked back until you are ready to press forward to swing, much like how a real batter would hold his bat back, allows the whole hitting process to be one fluid movement, and therefore full momentum and power is maximized).


Release To Rest
Pull back on the right stick to start the step,
and then RELEASE IT TO CENTER REST POSITION, before pushing forward to swing.

(I personally use the "Release To Rest" method finding it produces better results for me. However I know people who use the "Hold Cocked Back" method who say that method produces better results. Therefore, I suggest you test them both out, and use the method which works better for you).



:thumbsup: SIXTH, DIRECTIONAL HITTING

You are going to want to be able to hit the ball to different parts of the infield and outfield, and with Swing Stick 2.0 you can.

(NOTE: You will also be able to influence fly balls and ground balls in directional hitting, by timing your step early to hit fly balls to the outfield, or timing your step late to hit ground balls in the infield. See next section for more details on influencing fly balls and ground balls).

THESE FOLLOWING RULES ARE ALSO THE PRIMARY RIGHT STICK SWING MOTIONS/MOVEMENTS:

RULES:

To hit down the left field line, press right stick to 9 o'clock position.
To hit between left field line and left fielder, press right stick to 10 o'clock position.
To hit between left fielder and center fielder, press right stick to 11 o'clock position.

To hit to center field, press right stick to 12 o'clock position.

To hit down the right field line, press right stick to 3 o'clock position.
To hit between right field line and right fielder, press right stick to 2 o'clock position.
To hit between right fielder and center fielder, press right stick to 1 o'clock position.



:thumbsup: SEVENTH, HIT INFLUENCE: FLY BALLS AND/OR GROUND BALLS.

There are four primary schools of thought/methods to hit fly balls and/or ground balls. They are:

Multiple Factors
Step Timing
Left Stick
Right Stick

I will address each separately.


Multiple Factors
"Multiple Factors" is more a school of thought about hitting, than a method.

It points out that your ability to influence the hit (specifically, wether you are able to hit a fly ball or ground ball), is determined based primarily on the pitcher's pitch ratings, your batter's contact ratings, your step and swing timing, and batter's eye use.

That these factors have an influence on the type of hits your batter produces is certainly true. However that necessarily also suggests that the amount of user control isn't as precise, or consistent as one would want to believe is possible.


Step Timing
The "Step Timing" school of thought/method of hitting credibly illustrates that the timing of your step will often actually influence your ability to hit fly balls and/or ground balls.

Beginning your step early/late DEFINITELY & CONSISTENTLY influences fly/ground balls.

RULE: If you take your step early, you are more likely to hit a fly ball.

The reason is because stepping early leaves you leaning back
(which tends to pop the ball up).

RULE: If you take your step late, you are more likely to hit a ground ball.

The reason is because stepping late leaves you leaning forward
(which tends to drive the ball down).

(NOTE: I DID see consistent results with this method in terms of having control over fly balls/ground balls by taking an early/late step; but DID NOT see consistent results with either of the following remaining two methods).


Left Stick
Some have suggested you can use the left stick in the same manner you use in in classic batting to influence fly balls and/or ground balls.

Push the left stick up to hit a fly ball.

Push the left stick down to hit a ground ball.

(NOTE: As mentioned, I DID NOT see consistent results with this method, and therefore cannot say it is a certain feature of the game).


Right Stick
Some have suggested you can use the right stick in a particular way to influence fly balls or ground balls.

Push the right stick in any of the above mentioned primary right stick swing motions/movements to hit a fly ball.

For example, push the right stick to 12 o'clock; push the right stick to 3 o'clock; or push the right stick 9 o'clock.

Mimic the pitch gesture used to throw curve ball, to hit a ground ball.

Simply put, these movements used to influence ground ball hits are the same movements (pitch gestures) you make to throw a curve ball with your pitcher.

To influence a ground ball to the SS/3B side of the infield, pull your right stick down to step, and then rotate it around the bottom perimeter up and left to swing (clockwise).

To influence a ground ball to the 2B/1B side of the infield, pull your right stick down to step, and then rotate it around the bottom perimeter up and left to swing (counterclockwise).

(NOTE: As mentioned, I DID NOT see consistent results with this method, and therefore cannot say it is a certain feature of the game).



:hi: *****END***** :hi:



:thumbsup: BATTER UP.

Good Luck!

[jeffy777]

vicarcaligulush: Good post BTW. There have been alot of posts about how the Swing Stick works, so this should help those who are having trouble.

[bnreidy]

hey vicarcaligulush!

Great work, thanks mate, i live in Australia, and just got the game yesterday, shipped over from USA, and i actually like the game, though i need some practising on my hitting, i think i am doing ok for my first few games! i like the pitching now! and i havent really given up many Hrs, though i am still losing, i know with more practice the games will get better i and should be able to win won!, i will use these tips for hitting!!

cheers

[ksig24]

Good information for novice users and I am sure the community will find this useful. Clinton if you dont have anything good to say than keep it to yourself.

[pairunoyd]

(is there a way to quote only portions of a post? i usually highlight and click quote, but that doesnt seem to work)

You say to step just before the pitcher releases. This advice is woefully ambiguous. Define, 'just before'.

[sleepytercel]

I cleared up the clutter of posts from a certain user.

[vicarcaligulush]

vicarcaligulush: Good post BTW. There have been alot of posts about how the Swing Stick works, so this should help those who are having trouble.

thanks jeff, yes the swing stick, and step timing in particular, is a curiosity and problematic in some degree from minor to major for many people ...

so i've gone to many forums, and read many threads, and gathered as much information about it as possible, and then practiced and tested it ...

and then came up with what i wrote above, which hopefully will be a sound foundation to help people, novice or otherwise, become better hitters ...

[pairunoyd]

my understanding of the saying, 'just before' is for all practical purposes, 'at the same time'. What I mean by that is that my human mind is not capable of telling the difference between .00000001 seconds before release and .00000000000001 seconds before release. So if you say 'just before' Im assuming you mean I should time my step as closely to the release of the pitch as possible without actually stepping at the same time or later. So a step .001 seconds before release is better than .1 second before release?

[pairunoyd]

vicar, sorry for being a jerk in my first post. i really appreciate what youre doing!!!

[Alai]

I guess that we all need to turn the step feedback(whether it was early or late step and swing) to on, correct?

I also assume that if the timing was perfect(or close to), it doesn't say anything on screen.

Are these correct presumption?

[zackman424]

Hey Vicarcaligilush i think u can influence ground balls and fly balls by the left stick. if u push down on the left stick, u will swing your bat lower in the strikezone, push up, and u swing higher. so if u want a ground ball, swing ur bat higher to get on top of the ball. and below the ball would give u a flyball( or a very annoying pop up).

[jeffy777]

I guess that we all need to turn the step feedback(whether it was early or late step and swing) to on, correct?

I also assume that if the timing was perfect(or close to), it doesn't say anything on screen.

Are these correct presumption?

Yes, and yes.

[DARKSPACE]

I use the 2.0 R-stick in many different variations. Think of my post as a face you will see on a round clock. This would be better understood if I was to draw you a graph, but if you need a understanding of what I'm trying to say, try referring it to you throwing and using 2k8's pitchstylie and gestures as a reference.

I swing sometimes straight up: 6to12
I swing sometimes straight to left or right: 6to9, 6to3.
I swing sometimes in upward angle postion: 6to10, 6to11, 6to2 or 6to1
Or sometimes I actually use a circuliar motion: 6to5-4-3, 6-to7-8-9
http://arcytech.org/java/clock/images/clock_littlehand_11.gifhttp://arcytech.org/java/clock/images/clock_littlehand_3.gif
Regardless of the Rstick motion I use, it all comes down to the pitchtype, pitch location, batters eye and your step timiing for your lefty or Righty batter. Once these mechanics are in perfect place you can actual be a Tony Gwynn type batter when it comes to directional hitting.

Nothing more better than playing small ball, executing Sac fly, producing grounders away from the runner, or simply trying to Hammer the ball down the line, in the gap or over the wall.

[CWSpartan9]

I find that your timing and where you aim the pitch guess locator have a large influence on your hits.

If you guess a pitch will be low and it is high I find that you will pop it up a lot and vice versa.

Also, if you are late on a pitch you have a better chance of hitting a grounder and if you are out in front you will have a great chance of hitting a weak fly ball.

[vicarcaligulush]

vicar, sorry for being a jerk in my first post. i really appreciate what youre doing!!!

You weren't being a jerk pair, but your "seconds and miliseconds" post did make me scratch my head momentarily and think, if he has it timed to miliseconds, he's gotta be like a virtual barry bonds of video game hitting (sans the juice one would hope). :)

[Alai]

Release To Rest
Pull back on the right stick to start the step,
and then RELEASE IT TO CENTER REST POSITION, before pushing forward to swing.

(I personally use the "Release To Rest" method finding it produces better results for me. However I know people who use the "Hold Cocked Back" method who say that method produces better results. Therefore, I suggest you test them both out and use the method which works better for you).


Holy crap, this thing works, and works beautifully! I was skeptical at first but tried it anyway, and found that after practicing for awhile, it made it so much easier for me to decide to swing or not to swing. That little pause by releasing the stick makes me more relaxed to decide whether it will be ball or strike, and swing or not swing accordingly.

At first I found myself a little late at swinging especially on fastballs, but with enough practice my eyes just became faster and swung at right timing. I just found myself more comfortable at the plate instead of being nervous and always twitching to want to push up as soon as pulling back at cocked position.

As for whether this way of swing affecting the hitting result... well I don't think it really hurts it because I had variety of hits including 1 homerun by Ichiro! Thanks for finding a much easier and confident way to swing Vicar. This is AweSome!@! :thumbsup:

[GhostRider]

Playing HR Derby is the best way to get hitting down.

[Rhymz]

Great post!!!

[2K Admin Ron]

Yes, excellent post.

[bigfnjoe96]

Yes, excellent post.

STICKY, STICKY, STICKY, STICKY, STICKY......

[JUMBO]

Great post vicarcaligulush, also great addition Darkspace.

Very informative, and as we get more and more experience with the game I'm sure we will see which one of these methods work and which ones do not. But we can for sure test each of them out and see which method is best for our play style(s).

Thanks.

EDIT: Sticky would be nice.

[pairunoyd]

So the best step-timing is the smallest amount time possible before pitch release? If so, I ALWAYS get, Very Late Step feedback. Is the feedback mechanism accurate?

If you do prescribe to this timing, how can you have time to: pull right stick back, release to neutral position, push forward? (I know that's not everyone's technique, but some are doing that).

This stuff should be spelled out by the developers, showing the pitchers and best step timing.

[mjranieri]

Im a little confused about the pull back and the the rest position and then the swing. i know what you mean as far as mechanics but how can you do all that in the time it takes for the ball to go from the pitcher to the plate? I may have bad skills and maybe cant judge quick enough but that seems like a lot of judgement in a short time frame? Basically im stuck swinging at everything and cursing myself when its a ball in the dirt which is so annoying to do and then have the announcers chastise me. lol So any way to explain the best way to judge if its a ball or strike taking in to account the different types of pitches for different counts. Thank You

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

I use the 2.0 R-stick in many different variations. Think of my post as a face you will see on a round clock. This would be better understood if I was to draw you a graph, but if you need a understanding of what I'm trying to say, try referring it to you throwing and using 2k8's pitchstylie and gestures as a reference.

I swing sometimes straight up: 6to12
I swing sometimes straight to left or right: 6to9, 6to3.
I swing sometimes in upward angle postion: 6to10, 6to11, 6to2 or 6to1
Or sometimes I actually use a circuliar motion: 6to5-4-3, 6-to7-8-9
http://arcytech.org/java/clock/images/clock_littlehand_11.gifhttp://arcytech.org/java/clock/images/clock_littlehand_3.gif
Regardless of the Rstick motion I use, it all comes down to the pitchtype, pitch location, batters eye and your step timiing for your lefty or Righty batter. Once these mechanics are in perfect place you can actual be a Tony Gwynn type batter when it comes to directional hitting.

Nothing more better than playing small ball, executing Sac fly, producing grounders away from the runner, or simply trying to Hammer the ball down the line, in the gap or over the wall.

Using a clock is a good way to describe the swing stick and pitching. However, a more accurate depiction would be to have 8 markers within the circle and not 12. That is how analog sticks are designed to function, 2 times the motions of a direction pad (4) not 3 times the motions of a direction pad.

Also, check swings are easier to perform when you're trying to execute a contact swing (roll RS) as opposed to performing a power swing. Because the motion to go back to 6 o'clock is quicker than if you're trying to go to 12 o'clock with a power swing.

[vicarcaligulush]

Great post vicarcaligulush, also great addition Darkspace.
EDIT: Sticky would be nice.

Thanks JUMBO. And I like the DARK's and Bl00d's and Bl00d's clock pictures too.

[vicarcaligulush]

So the best step-timing is the smallest amount time possible before pitch release? If so, I ALWAYS get, Very Late Step feedback. Is the feedback mechanism accurate?

Hey pair, yes you are correct about the timing. The best timing "in general" is the last moment before the pitch is released from the pitcher's hand.

It is a "general rule" because it applies to most animations of most batters. Remember, different batters have longer or shorter strides, so your step is going to be earlier or later accordingly.

With this general rule and modification rule in hand, I agree with someone's suggestions earlier, that it's best to go into home run derby and practive a bit. And practice with a few different batters on your favorite team so you can better guage the different stride animations.

I'd even suggest also practicing against a minor league team (since it would probably be much easier to pick up on the pitcher's release point, as well as guage your own step timing).

In no time at all you'll have a much better grasp and feel for the step timing.

Good luck!

[vicarcaligulush]

Im a little confused about the pull back and the the rest position and then the swing. i know what you mean as far as mechanics but how can you do all that in the time it takes for the ball to go from the pitcher to the plate?

Hi, mjr, actually it's easier than you think!

Remember, when you pull back, that is the step which "begins the stride".

Therefore, when you release the stick (just let go of it, no need to even think about it, it's that simple), you have ample time to them push the stick forward to swing, because the animation is then taking place!

I hope that makes sense. Someone else recently posted about success with it. It's not complicated at all. You'll get it! :)

[vicarcaligulush]

Holy crap, this thing works, and works beautifully! I was skeptical at first but tried it anyway, and found that after practicing for awhile, it made it so much easier for me to decide to swing or not to swing. That little pause by releasing the stick makes me more relaxed to decide whether it will be ball or strike, and swing or not swing accordingly.

Thanks for finding a much easier and confident way to swing Vicar. This is AweSome!@! :thumbsup:

Great to hear Alai!

[DARKSPACE]

Using a clock is a good way to describe the swing stick and pitching. However, a more accurate depiction would be to have 8 markers within the circle and not 12. That is how analog sticks are designed to function, 2 times the motions of a direction pad (4) not 3 times the motions of a direction pad.
Yes I understand your point Blood, cause I too know the limitations and use of the analog stick

I was offering the broad scope of things due to it's quite difficult to put into words without posting a book.
- Depending on batting Lefty/Righty I swing 6to10, 6to11 as a pitch is located High & Tight or High & Away
- Depending on batting Lefty/Righy I swing 6to1, 6to2 as a pitch is located High & Away or High & Tight
- Regardless what side of the plate I'm batting I swing 6to12 if its Middle Up or Directly center of the plate..

Once again this is how I use 2.0 batting, I usually try to use my swing motion going with the pitch location depending on the batter power/contact ratings of course. Nothing better than trying to hit one far and deep but you end up with nothing but a short dribbler cause it hit the bottom of you bat. lol

[Alai]

Im a little confused about the pull back and the the rest position and then the swing. i know what you mean as far as mechanics but how can you do all that in the time it takes for the ball to go from the pitcher to the plate? I may have bad skills and maybe cant judge quick enough but that seems like a lot of judgement in a short time frame? Basically im stuck swinging at everything and cursing myself when its a ball in the dirt which is so annoying to do and then have the announcers chastise me. lol So any way to explain the best way to judge if its a ball or strike taking in to account the different types of pitches for different counts. Thank You
Try this. When pitcher is about to end the windup, pull it back. As he releases the ball, let go of the stick. Don't swing at all. Do this over and over.

After few workouts of just letting go, you'll start to get comfortable and start to see the pitch of where it'll end up.

Now start pushing the stick up. You'll be more keen now on what to swing and what not to swing.

Think of it as three easy seperate steps. Not one clumped rushed step where you pretty much swing or not swing no matter where the ball is going.

p.s. Yes that is so annoying when I swing at the ball in the dirt, and the announcer makes fun of me makes me want to punch him in the face! :D

[pairunoyd]

Hey pair, yes you are correct about the timing. The best timing "in general" is the last moment before the pitch is released from the pitcher's hand.

It is a "general rule" because it applies to most animations of most batters. Remember, different batters have longer or shorter strides, so your step is going to be earlier or later accordingly.

With this general rule and modification rule in hand, I agree with someone's suggestions earlier, that it's best to go into home run derby and practive a bit. And practice with a few different batters on your favorite team so you can better guage the different stride animations.

I'd even suggest also practicing against a minor league team (since it would probably be much easier to pick up on the pitcher's release point, as well as guage your own step timing).

In no time at all you'll have a much better grasp and feel for the step timing.

Good luck!

Anyone know how to do partial quotes on these boards?

Vic, when I do as you say I always get the 'Very Late Step' feedback. If I do the step somewhere around the time of the pitchers beginning forward motion I get better feedback. I'd GUESS that point in time is maybe 1 second before release? Why does it say Very Late Step if I do as you say above?

[vicarcaligulush]

Anyone know how to do partial quotes on these boards?

Vic, when I do as you say I always get the 'Very Late Step' feedback. If I do the step somewhere around the time of the pitchers beginning forward motion I get better feedback. I'd GUESS that point in time is maybe 1 second before release? Why does it say Very Late Step if I do as you say above?

Hey pair, first, the way I do partial quotes, is by clicking the quote button normally so the whole passage shows up. Then delete the part of the quote you don't want to refer to. What's left is your partial quote.

As to step timing, if you have better timing at the pitchers forward motion, then by all means use that. However I found in searching boards and testing batting, that the timing of just before release worked best.

And again remember different batters will have different stride animations, and so their step timing will be different. The general rule is used as a starting point which more often than not results in the perfect or near perfect timing.

The individual batters stride animations, and even different pitcher wind up and release animations, will act as modifiers to the general rule on stepping as the pitcher releases the ball.

[pairunoyd]

Hey pair, first, the way I do partial quotes, is by clicking the quote button normally so the whole passage shows up. Then delete the part of the quote you don't want to refer to. What's left is your partial quote.

As to step timing, if you have better timing at the pitchers forward motion, then by all means use that. However I found in searching boards and testing batting, that the timing of just before release worked best.

And again remember different batters will have different stride animations, and so their step timing will be different. The general rule is used as a starting point which more often than not results in the perfect or near perfect timing.

The individual batters stride animations, and even different pitcher wind up and release animations, will act as modifiers to the general rule on stepping as the pitcher releases the ball.

yea, i knew the quote and delete option was available but it sucks. most boards i use i simply highlight the text, click quote and thats the portion quoted. grrrr. :)

So the feedback system is inaccurate?

[vicarcaligulush]

hey pair, the feedback system works well and accurately yes.

i decided it's best to discuss proper step timing in terms of "when the pitcher makes his move towards home".

i don't want to get too techinical since i'm trying to keep this tips/hints guide as simple as possible, but i amended the second section on page 1 to incorporate a simpler more efficient and broader reaching general rule on timing step.

it should help you as well as anyone else having the same troubles you were having.

[totalownership]

Nice post there brutal. And to think you came up with this all by yourself. lol

[DARKSPACE]

Thanks JUMBO. And I like the DARK's and Bl00d's and Bl00d's clock pictures too.
Actually Blood's contribution was a critque of my picture post. Regardless your thread serves as a usefull tool.

[vicarcaligulush]

Nice post there brutal. And to think you came up with this all by yourself. lol

thanks TO ...

TO and i played yanks indians to pretty much test out some of these hints/tips ...

(TO is one of the people i referred to in the fifth section of this guide who likes using, and prefers the "hold it cocked back" method of hitting).

[Bwnarrow3]

Holy crap, this thing works, and works beautifully! I was skeptical at first but tried it anyway, and found that after practicing for awhile, it made it so much easier for me to decide to swing or not to swing. That little pause by releasing the stick makes me more relaxed to decide whether it will be ball or strike, and swing or not swing accordingly.

At first I found myself a little late at swinging especially on fastballs, but with enough practice my eyes just became faster and swung at right timing. I just found myself more comfortable at the plate instead of being nervous and always twitching to want to push up as soon as pulling back at cocked position.

As for whether this way of swing affecting the hitting result... well I don't think it really hurts it because I had variety of hits including 1 homerun by Ichiro! Thanks for finding a much easier and confident way to swing Vicar. This is AweSome!@! :thumbsup:
I will try this when I get home.

Question, though. Can you still push the stick to "3 o clock" and "9 o clock" to swing?

Thanks.

[vicarcaligulush]

^^ yes Bwnarrow. in fact, you will often want to do that (see the section on directional hitting).

Directional Hitting (generally)
9 o'clock - down the left field line
10 o'clock - between left field foul line and left fielder
11 o'clock - between left fielder and center fielder

12 o'clock - center field

3 o'clock - down right field line
2 o'clock - between right field line and right fielder
1 o'clock - between right fielder and center fielder

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

What is important to note is what direction you take your back step. Taking a back step towrads 7 or 8 o'clock, as opposed to straight dowan at 6 o'clock, will help your batter catch up to pitches inside our outside. It is like moving your batter in that direction. Many of you played MVP 2005. If you recall you could move the batter left by pressing L1 and right by pressing R1 (Playstion 2). Taking a back step slightly left/ right in MLB 2k8 functions exactly the same way.

[vicarcaligulush]

What is important to note is what direction you take your back step. Taking a back step towrads 7 or 8 o'clock, as opposed to straight dowan at 6 o'clock, will help your batter catch up to pitches inside our outside. It is like moving your batter in that direction. Many of you played MVP 2005. If you recall you could move the batter left by pressing L1 and right by pressing R1 (Playstion 2). Taking a back step slightly left/ right in MLB 2k8 functions exactly the same way.

Thanks for pointing that out Bl00d. My original post is filled to the max for me to have included that. I would have called it "batter's box positioning".

However, the testing I've done with it showed me that (unlike what someone else has said) the batter's step DOES NOT actually change in a way that you can "see" (and I've tested it with different batters from different teams, and none of them show an actual change in step animation like the person suggested).

Now that is not to say it doesn't work as suggested, so I'm neither convinced nor unconvinced of it being part of the game. But the time I've spent with it, I haven't seen any batter's step change from his normal step animation. And to be honest I haven't seen an improved ability to make/improve contact with it. I will spend more time with it however.

I suspect the perceived benefit to pulling the stick back at an angle has more to do with a particular batter having high contact ratings, than the actual position of the stick.

Nevertheless, to your other point, yes, this does have some MVP feel to it, doesn't it? And I'm very glad about that.

[Bwnarrow3]

^^^

It's amazing how many nice ideas have been put in the new hit stick, and I had no idea!

[vicarcaligulush]

^^^

It's amazing how many nice ideas have been put in the new hit stick, and I had no idea!

definitely bwnarrow. once you get the three basic ideas of hitting down:

->step timing (with small variation taken into account for different batter animations),

->directional hitting (see that section on right stick swing direction), and then also

->influencing the hit (timing step early/late for grounders/fly balls),

you'll find you'll be a much better hitter than you were before understanding these important areas of hitting.

[Bwnarrow3]

Good thing this is stickied. The "Release To Rest" method is really working for me. I hardly ever strike out!

[totalownership]

thanks TO ...

TO and i played yanks indians to pretty much test out some of these hints/tips ...

(TO is one of the people i referred to in the fifth section of this guide who likes using, and prefers the "hold it cocked back" method of hitting).
LOL, naw I wasn't looking for any props. I was just messing with you. lol

[vicarcaligulush]

LOL, naw I wasn't looking for any props. I was just messing with you. lol

haha i know ... but gotta give props where props are due ...

[eastcoastcrushr]

Wow. What losers! Just pull back and slam forward. To pull the ball swing early, togo opposite field swing late. What's with all this mumbo jumbo? Swingstick is so simple, if you need a thread explaining it, you got problems.

[vicarcaligulush]

Swingstick is so simple, if you need a thread explaining it, you got problems.

too bad attitude adjustment isn't as simple ...
thanks anyway for your contribution, and
get well soon east :)

[vicarcaligulush]

Good thing this is stickied. The "Release To Rest" method is really working for me. I hardly ever strike out!

glad it's working for you Bwnarrow ... and be sure to focus also on the sections on: step timing, directional hitting, and influencing the hit ...

[ajdudeman281]

how is it the defensive/ contact swing works?

[vicarcaligulush]

hey aj, the defensive swing doesn't work as it states in the manual ...

if you want to swing like that i can only suggest that you "go with the pitch" more than usual (both in terms of timing your step/influencing the hit, i.e, if the pitch is low, time your step late to influence a ground ball and vice versa; and and in terms of directional hitting, i.e, if the pitch is up and out, use your right stick to put an up and out swing on it).

[Hank Steinbrenner]

I'm a little embarrased to say but I'm still having problems. I've tried the **** and hold (lol) method and the rest method but it doesn't seem to make a difference. When I try to pull it back when the pitcher's arm begins to throw the ball it says I'm too early when I do it a bit later, I feel like I don't have enough time to react. The pitchers throw so many strikes that it's hard to adjust stride time for each batter. Can anyone help me with this whole step thing again? Some people say to do it when he releasesm some are saying to do it when he finishes the windup (whenever that is).

P.S.

Any chance the patch can remove Jeannie Zilazkow from the game?

[flindip]

I think another thing that has to be mentioned as a hitting tip...you don't want to pull pitches with batters that dont have alot of power...you will almost never get it out of the infield..only batters who have decent power are only the ones who can really influence where the ball is going to end up either left or right...if you have a contact batter with low power...you want to sit on pitches and just simply hit the ball(occasionally you may want to influence the ball in order to do a Sac ground to get a rbi or something)...

[vicarcaligulush]

I'm a little embarrased to say but I'm still having problems.
No need to be embarrassed Hank. You just need to become more familiar with it. Everyone has a tough time right out of the gate.

Choose a method which feels more comfortable for you, and then just practice watching when the pitcher "makes his move home" to time your step. The more you do that, the better a hitter you'll be.

Also, this is a technical point, just to answer a question you posed. I saw you mention that you don't think there's enough time to use the release method, but actually there is.

Remember pulling the stick back starts the step and stride animation. The step and stride animation takes probably about a second or so. And since that second is longer than the time it takes for the stick to release to rest position after you've pulled it back to start the step, there is ample time to push forward for the swing (in either situation, whether you release to rest, or hold it cocked back).

[Hank Steinbrenner]

Hey Vicar, thanks a lot, you're probably the most attentive poster I've ever seen, you make me feel warm inside! I've actually been using the release method after practicing and it has yielded good results. If this has been answered or posed before I apologize, but is there a difference in the level of power between the cocked back (lol) and release method? Last game with the Yankees, I had 4-5 runs on 12 hits. I'm hitting a lot of singles and a few doubles, but no rockets off the wall and especially no HRs. Any tips to increase power?

[vicarcaligulush]

Hey Vicar, thanks a lot ... Any tips to increase power?

hey hank, it's mostly about timing. some of it is pitcher quality, and some of it is pitch location.

for example, you can test this out ...

play a game against a minor league team, any minor league team.
you will notice even with average step (ie, early step, or late step), you will crush the ball, rip the cover off. that of course is because the quality of pitching is average to poor.

but compare the power (and even contact for that matter) you get if your timing (average) is the same against a major league pitcher, who throws the same types pitches, and puts them in the same locations, as the minor league pitcher did. overall you will see much weaker hits.

so you need to improve your timing to hit these major league pitchers with good power and good contact.

what pitcher you face, and what location he throws to you have no control over, but you can get more power by timing your step to the pitchers "initial move home".

you'll get more feel for judging initial move home, the more you play. and getting your timing down is the one thing (most important thing in my opinion) that you have most control over in terms of ensuring your hits have the most power behind them.

[G0d3L]

Nice job vicarcaligulush.
Can anyone explain the difference (from a hitting point of view) between pitch inside/outside and up/down.
I think that with pitches inside you have to to hit earlier and outside later, correct?
But the main question is about up/down: I can do something to improve the contact or it doesn't matter if the pitch is up or down?
I ask this also to understand better the pitching part of the game.

I appreciate a lot the more importance of timing to hit but I don't understand why they remove the use of the left stick to pint where the baseball is going.

[vicarcaligulush]

I think that with pitches inside you have to to hit earlier and outside later, correct?

But the main question is about up/down: I can do something to improve the contact or it doesn't matter if the pitch is up or down?

I appreciate a lot the more importance of timing to hit but I don't understand why they remove the use of the left stick to pint where the baseball is going.

Hey G0d, I'll try to answer each of your questions in order.

First, getting good contact on pitches inside or outside isn't as much about timing your swing early or late as much as it is "going with the pitch". And you do that by moving your right stick to the right or left side (depending on if the pitch is inside or outside).

As to your second question, speaking purely about good contact, you'll want to have the best step timing you can have and then also the best swing timing. Also, I'm not sure if you alluded to this, but influencing a fly ball or grounder can definitely be done (see that section). All you do is time your step early for a fly ball, or time it late for a ground ball.

And lastly, yes the left stick use to influence hits was nice (still exists in classic hitting). I think 2K did well implementing concepts, but perhaps a slight tweak to mapping them out to the sticks differently would have been beneficial.

As it stands now though, I think the hitting controls are pretty darn good. I too would have liked a simpler left stick direction as the stick to use for influencing the hit, but after using the right stick more, I have come to appreciate it as pretty good in its own right.

[G0d3L]

I wasn't clear about the up/down question.
About inside/outside I know how to go with the pitch but it seems to me that there is a little time differnce for same pitches inside or outside. (on PRO I score every game 10-20 runs with 5-10 HRs so I have not problem with hitting but just tring to understand better the game)
The main question is about up/down.
When I pitch I can chose to pitch up or down and in real life it makes a great difference, but here when you hit it seems that up or down it's the same.
I know that swinging before you'll pop and swinging later you'll ground but I can hit HRs on pithces up or down without recognize if it's up or down, just see pitch type and if its inside outside.
It seems to me that you don't have to recognize if it's up or down cause it doesn't matter, so a big part of the pitching side of baseball is gone.
I'd like to know if it's so or not.
Thanks for all vicarcaligulush

[vicarcaligulush]

I wasn't clear about the up/down question.

The main question is about up/down.

When I pitch I can chose to pitch up or down and in real life it makes a great difference, but here when you hit it seems that up or down it's the same.

It seems to me that you don't have to recognize if it's up or down cause it doesn't matter, so a big part of the pitching side of baseball is gone.

I'd like to know if it's so or not.
Thanks for all vicarcaligulush

Hey G0d, ok thanks for helping me understand. Well, to answer you, I have to say I really don't know for sure. I can only tell you what my experience has been and give you a guess.

I think batters ratings (and hot and cold zones) have a lot to do with effectiveness of a pitch low or high, and how well a batter hits it. In addition, I think that in batter's cold zones, your timing has to be near perfect to increase your chance of a hit, while in hot zones timing doesn't have to be as perfect.

Let me explain.

I'll use two players from my Indians as an example. Someone like back up catcher Kelly Shoppach, will not be often able to get solid contact on low and outside pitches (unless timing is perfect). However, even if it is, it only increases the chance of contact, but his contact effectiveness/probability remains low because it is his cold zone.

So high/low pitch recognition would matter here because you'd want to lay off those pitches if you can, and instead wait for his pitch (as determinded bases on hot cold zones).

Compare on the other hand, starting catcher Victor Martinez, who has very few weaknesses hitting, and can hit low and outside as well as high and inside. So for Victor, recognizing a low or high hit doesn't matter as much because he can get good contact on both of these kinds of pitches. He does so because he is a better hitter.

And another additional layer/dimension to this is the hot cold zone power ratings. Knowing what power exists in the different areas of the strike zone also I would think should also contribute to a decision to lay off and wait for another pitch, or not.

Anyway, I hope that helps some. I think with the range of hitter quality on my team (Indians), my observations likely hold true for all batters/teams in this game (depending on their contact ratings and hot cold zones). As explained, that's been my experience with the Indians hitters, most of whom are C to C+ contact hitters, a few D hitters sprinkled in, and of course Hafner, Sizemore, and Martinez being best and only higher rated B to A hitters.

And important to highlight, with these latter better batters, I notice it's less important to recognize low and high pitches since they all hit all types well (while with the lower rated hitters it's more important for me to know their hot cold zones, make sure their timing is perfect, and wait for pitches more).

(Similarly, this will also be the same when using a team with great hitting like the Yankees. With so many good hitters on that roster, it's less important to recognize high/low pitches since that team hits all kinds of pitches. But compare that to a poor hitting team, which will require more patience, understanding of the batter's hot cold zones, and therefore recognition of high/low pitches, so you can increase the chance of better contact).

So overall, I'd say yes, that recognizing pitches low or high does matter yes (both as a batter knowing when to swing and when to lay off, and a pitcher who knows a batter's ability and tendency).

[G0d3L]

vicarcaligulush thank you a lot for your long and complete answer.
It seems that the hitting style it's more MVPesque.
From a Swing Stick 2.0 point of view there are differences in what I have to do to hit a fastball up (in the middle) and a fastball down (always in the middle)?
This is waht I really want to know.
It seems to me that there are no differences and I don't like this thing at all.
When I throw for strike a 12-6 curve away and it breaks at mid height of the strike zone the only thing that its' important in this game (hot & cold zones away) is timing; so if I recognize/guess a slower pitch away (it could seem to me like a belt-eye changeup) it doesn't matter if it's up or down or wherever it is.

[vicarcaligulush]

It seems that the hitting style it's more MVPesque.

From a Swing Stick 2.0 point of view there are differences in what I have to do to hit a fastball up (in the middle) and a fastball down (always in the middle)?

This is waht I really want to know.


I think you are right to a point G0d, but I don't think it's necessarily bad. I think the hitter's contact ratings influence his bat position up and down, and therefore type of potential hit (with other things also affecting it like pitcher quality, timing, etc). And I've seen different swing animations up and down, so I know the batter does swing high and low.

Often times it's out of our control, but I think that's a good thing because pro hitters really can't tell you the kind of hit they are going to get before they get it. All they can do is try to influence the hit. And you can do that in this game with a fly ball or ground ball (as explained in guide).

So there can be a difference if you choose there to be one.

But beyond that, no you don't really have to do anything differently to hit a high fastball or a low fastball if all you are looking to do is make the best contact. It's simply a matter of timing your step and swing to influence the direction and type of hit you want (combined with the swing animation, hot or cold zone, and contact rating, which all blend to determine the type of hit that might result).

[vicarcaligulush]

PS: I can only speculate on some of these things based on the experience I've had. But I did write the 4 developers who are supposed to play on line this weekend, and asked them to come to this board (this thread in particular), and confirm, reject, and clarify some things about hitting which may or may not be discussed in this thread.

If they will or won't, time will tell. But I think ultimately the best thing would be for the ones who created the game to take some time out to explain things for us here.

We'll see. In the meantime the only things I can be sure about are the things in the guide which I tested and verified myself, and with the help of others.

[JackB]

I have a question. Why do we have to have so many threads guessing about how the AI works? Why doesn't 2k Sports just give us and online manual which actually explains a bit about the mechanics?

There is so much speculation about do I step early for a fly ball, late for a ground ball, can I take the bat back at 5 o'clock and push forward to 1 o'clock for a hit to right.

For all we really know, none of this does anything. We're guessing unless the developers post here and tell us it we're right or we just believe it's happening, when in reality it's not.

[vicarcaligulush]

I have a question. Why do we have to have so many threads guessing about how the AI works? Why doesn't 2k Sports just give us and online manual which actually explains a bit about the mechanics?

There is so much speculation about do I step early for a fly ball, late for a ground ball, can I take the bat back at 5 o'clock and push forward to 1 o'clock for a hit to right.

For all we really know, none of this does anything. We're guessing unless the developers post here and tell us it we're right or we just believe it's happening, when in reality it's not.

I agree with you 2K should explain it themselves, but the things listed in the guide ARE certain. Stepping early and/or late will influence fly balls/ground balls. Everything about influencing the pitch, directional hitting, step timing, etc in the guide on page 1 is confirmed.

We're talking recently about nuances which are beyond the scope of the original guide on page 1.

So while I agree, and as mentioned, asked 2K devs to come to this board this weekend and upcoming week, in no way does that mean the guide itself is incomplete or inaccurate. As the expression goes, the guide is tried, tested, and true.

We'd just like more certain information without having to figure out more things ourselves, that's all.

[G0d3L]

PS: I can only speculate on some of these things based on the experience I've had. But I did write the 4 developers who are supposed to play on line this weekend, and asked them to come to this board (this thread in particular), and confirm, reject, and clarify some things about hitting which may or may not be discussed in this thread.

If they will or won't, time will tell. But I think ultimately the best thing would be for the ones who created the game to take some time out to explain things for us here.


That would be the best thing. I hope they'll come here to see and explain better how the thing works.
Thank you again vicarcaligulush

[misfitbulala]

POWER SWING is one fluid motion from 6 o clock to 10-2 0 clock.

CONTACT SWING is holding @ 6 o clock and rotate left or right.

it is on the in-game tips on xbox 360.

the POWER swing is crap though, i use the STEP-PAUSE method stated earlier for a Power Swing and that works fine.

the CONTACT SWING is great, no change needed there.

[ThomaMon]

Can you share some info on how the batters eye effects hitting?

[kevroman]

so did the developers ever answer your questions?

[dancutch]

I don't think I am reinventing the wheel or anything, but I definitely believe there are certain swings for certain players. For example, when using the Royals if I am batting with Mark Teahan I will use the 6 to 12 if I am in his power zone. However, for Alex Gordon the pull (to the Right) motion is more consistent for him.

Definitely, the timing and the pitch are very important, but don't underestimate the player's tendencies. And use the hit-n-run correctly and you can score some major runs.

[vicarcaligulush]

POWER SWING is one fluid motion from 6 o clock to 10-2 0 clock.

CONTACT SWING is holding @ 6 o clock and rotate left or right.

it is on the in-game tips on xbox 360.

the POWER swing is crap though, i use the STEP-PAUSE method stated earlier for a Power Swing and that works fine.

the CONTACT SWING is great, no change needed there.

this is what the tips say but they are wrong, it's been tested. there is no power v contact swing difference other than that which might be based on player ratings and step timing.

[vicarcaligulush]

Can you share some info on how the batters eye effects hitting?

hi Thoma, i haven't used/tested batter's eye much, especially since other threads have already talked about it. however consensus seems to be that putting it up high in the strike zone is best. there's also another thread about how it works (in particular how pitches only show up when you guess correctly, AND for only certain types of pitches), but i haven't tested that either.

[vicarcaligulush]

so did the developers ever answer your questions?

sadly no, kev, we're left with what we know here and what tweaks we can make to our collective knowledge by practice and testing.

[Bald Sidious]

Hey Vicar,

I am new on the:) forum. I first want to thank you for taking the time to help us that are having
trouble hitting its awesome. My two questions I have for you are. When you are talking about
"when the pitcher makes his move to home"?. Are you saying as the pitcher releases the ball
I'm not to sure if I am understanding you. And my second question is. What batting camera are you using that gives you the best look at the velocity and break of the pitch?. I actually use the wide zoom view with default camera zoom. I would love to see what camera you are currently using that helps you hit more consistently. Again thanx for your
time You have helped me alot.

[vicarcaligulush]

Hi Bald, welcome to these forums! Pretty cool place overall.

To your questions/comments ... wide zoom is the best camera in my opinion too. It makes it much easier to pick up the difference between balls and strikes.

As to your other question, "when the pitcher makes his move home", that means any movment, however slight, be it arm head, leg, torso, whatever, that actually physically begins to come TOWARDS home, such that the pitcher has COMMITTED to throwing home.

I think I wrote that on page on in the manual, but that's basically it. It's also what lets runners time their step when stealing bases too. Once a pitcher has made his move home, he MUST throw home.

And for this games purpoposes, once you see the pitcher initially begin/make his move home, that's when you step (with slight variation for different batter step animations which are faster or slower).

[sarsippius]

Good guide, some things ive figured out already, but the fly ball/ ground ball one is new to me so that should be helpful.

it would be helpful if they left the message saying if you swing early or late up longer. Its kinda hard to read that when you're trying to swing at the pitch lol. I know youcan practice, but if you're against a new pitcher with a bit different delivery you can never be sure.

I base my contact (step timing) off of what the soudn effects are... if I hear a good crack of the bat on the ball then I assume my timing is right.

Anyone know about online? I know you need to swing early... should I be stepping earlier also?

My natural stick movement is about 1 o clock. Its just how I move the stick and I find I hit better with some hitters that way and some not so well. Like I play with the twins and my best hitters are always Delmon young (righty, hits in the gap often) Mike lamb (lefty, hits in the gap often) and Morneau (lefty, hits homers) but I dont hit that well with Mauer (compared to the others) which with that swing you would think he would hit well since hes a lefty, would think better then young who is a righty. Also I find I hit more home runs with Griffey compared to Ortiz, Griffey just hits the ball harder, Ortiz gets more bloop singles. That could be contributed to their different batter steps though.. hmm I'll have to try that one out.

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

Ground ball swings
Use a swing motion opposite of a power swing i.e. 6 o'clock (back step), rest the analog stick, then swing downwards towards 7 or 5 o'clock.

This creates a downward power swing which often times is the only swing you can use to make quality contact on pitches low in the k- zone. Don't roll the analog stick in a circular motion because that will use a contact swing. I downward swing is a great way to compliment a Hit & Run play, because your batter will increase his chances of hitting a ground ball, just as long as the pitch location is low. With any other type of swing you're likely to hit into a line drive out to an infielder, making for an easy double play. So stick with the ground ball swing when using the Hit & Run...... Also, you can hit a HR with this type of swing. I used a downward swing motion with Ryan Howard to jack a Roy Oswalt fastball out of the yard that was literally 2 feet high out of the k- zone (most impressive HR I've ever hit). When your timing is perfect you can do whatever you with any pitch, you'd be amazed.

[BrandonMUC2005]

Is this just something in my timing on my swing or is there something I can do to not hit everything to the right side>

[rockitsauce]

Occasionally, and not very often, when attempting to use the step and release technique the batter will perform a weak early swing. I haven't been able to pinpoint why this occurs. My thought is that I'm timing the step way too late. Has anyone else encountered this?

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

I've found that the most important thing to use is the step timing feedback. Just like you would when pitching (feedback on gesture), use the step timing feedback for perfect contact. Keep your eyes focused on the top of the screen where you get feedback on your step timing and swing. One of 4 message will flash at the top of your screen: Very Late, Late, Early, Very Early. When your step timing is perfect nothing will flash at the top of your screen because your timing lands right in between early and late. When up to bat I even take a pitch and press down on the RS for the sake of practicing my step timing and making sure my step timing is perfect. When your step timing is perfect, the stars align and everything falls into place. You can pull outside pitches and push inside pitches for base hits when your step timing is perfect.

[danthekid18]

I have a question I got the game and when I bat it wont swing i have XBOX360 I press A and it does nothing. Do you know why it does that and if you do can you please write back on here or on my e-mail dankamo@msn.com but if you don't that's ok I just really wanna play but i can't because I don't know how to bat. Thanks

[jrich83]

Read the manual, or the in-game instructions, or the rest of this thread. You have to use the right stick to swing. That's what this whole thread is about. If you want to use the "A" button to bat, you have to change your settings back to "Classic" in the bating options.

I really woudn't recommend using these old settings though. If you take some time to learn the new system, you can pull off a lot of diffrent kinds of hits, like straight down the foul line, or pushing hits the other way. You should really try it out.

You should also try reading instructions before asking silly questions too. ;)