Wow, just played online for the first time

[jeffy777]

First of all, let me say that this is NOT an anti-2K post.

I have had 2K8 since release day, and have really been enjoying playing against the AI offline, but now that I am very comfortable with the controls and have been beating up on the AI, I figured I would give the online a shot to see how it really was.

I thought people may have been exaggerating when they said the online lag was bad, but they sure were right: it's downright terrible! :(

2K7 was very playable online. Why is 2K8 so much worse? :confused:

For batting, you can't even wait to see if the ball is going to be in the zone because you have to swing so early.

For pitching, it's extremely difficult to get the pitches in the green consistently because of the lag. I have no problem with this offline, so it's not the framerate problem.....

Often in between at bats, you'll get the "waiting for oppenent" message, and your oppenent's voice cuts out, even through we both have very high-speed broadband connections.

Overall it's a terrible online experience.....

And it doesn't seem to be related to the framerate issue because the pitching/batting view is smooth offline.

Is the patch even going to address the lag issue? I don't see the point of focusing on getting the leagues up if the online play isn't even really playable.

My intent is not to bag on 2K. I just want to know if this lag problem is going to get resolved because it's shocking how bad it is right now and I would be surprised if the framerate patch fixes this because it seems to be un-related....but let's hope I'm wrong.

[JNC]

Whats funny about this is the "liaison", says that the framerate problem is mainly due to the VIP system and if I understand him correctly it is because too much info is being sent to VIP and the reason for the hiccups. Your absolutely right Jeffy. We are all being calmed by what may very well be a desperate attempt to keep us quiet and in denial about what the patch will actually fix. I AM NOT saying that the patch will not fix the online issue as WE ALL have to wait and see. But the lag you experience online is one of many problems...which the "liason" has stated in not so many careful words.

I am gonna say this is not a statement to bag on 2K or the admins/mods either...but I am skeptical as many are!

[JNC]

BTW...I would love to eat my words...just give us an online experience that is enjoyable...that is all I ask 2K

I can't wait to "Game with the Devs" so I can see how they like the lag online. I think I would respect a company that could just outright admit what they did wrong, apologize and try their hardest to fix the problem or at least be honest about if they even have the time or money to put into fixing the issue; all publically. They would get so much more respect from me in that case, rather then trying to pass the blame on to other issues that may or may not be the full truth.

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

Patches can be released for decreasing ping in online matches. Also removing images that cause a game to lag can be removed. It has been done in other games before, and I don't see why 2k wouldn't address it with the next patch. I'm pretty confident we'll see the game play smoothed out online with the next patch.

While the lag is bad it doesn't give either player an advantage. It is not as if one person is experiencing lag and the other person isn't. So both players adjust the same way and compensate for the lag by swinging earlier than they would offline and living with a few more mistake pitches. It is still a chess match despite the lag.

[jeffy777]

But with the batting, all your opponent has to do is throw a lot of balls and you'll get stuck out easily because you have to start swinging before you can really see where the final location will be.

That's the main issue that makes it almost unplayable.

[Bl00d h0und Gang]

But with the batting, all your opponent has to do is throw a lot of balls and you'll get stuck out easily because you have to start swinging before you can really see where the final location will be.

That's the main issue that makes it almost unplayable.

That is an overstatement. If your opponent is throwing you off-speed pitches you'll have an adequate amount of time to read the pitch. Fastballs are more tricky of course because they come in fast. The lag doesn't change when you take your back step. Online you take your back step right before the ball leaves the pitcher's hand, just as you would offline. If you start your swing and then you notice the ball is going out of the strike zone you can very easily check you swing this year. If your opponent is throwing you pitches in one or two spots out of the strike zone, trying to get you to chase, then you can stick your batters eye in that spot. If the pitch doesn't reveal you'll know it is most likely a strike. Whether you're playing online or offline you as a hitter will always be on a novice level if you don't put your batters eye in to use. Every thing merely is guess work without the assistance of your trusty batters eye.

[knicks05]

online is playable stfu and practice damnit

[jeffy777]

Yeah, it may be playable, but it sure is terrible compared to offline hitting/pitching....

[sleepytercel]

Compared to offline, yes, it doesn't match up. However, I've played about 60 games online and have adjusted to the point where I can make choices in how I play. I am currently 45-19 online, and I am currently batting a .350 average. I do get annoyed with how the cutscenes disrupt the voice communication and break the flow with the "waiting for opponent" screens. I have already submitted this issue to Ronnie. Online isn't unplayable, but I do feel that it's more noticable this year since the new mechanics are more timing based than they were last year. I hope they clear the lag though, and it is a problem that was on top of the list. If they can get online to run higher than 30FPS, then even the current lag won't be as much of an issue IMO.

[jeffy777]

Yeah, but the batting and pitching screens aren't affected by the framerate problem, so I really doubt increasing the framerate will help the timing problem, but I guess we shall see soon enough.

[teleswamp]

Online play is GARBAGE. period.

[DARKSPACE]

Online baseball needs three things to work, Pitching/Batting/Fielding if anyone of these three factors don't work in unity with each other then there will be consistant complaints in the online community. MLB2K8's Online Fielding Controls for me runs flawless, unfortunately it's the Pitcher/Batter confrontation that causes my concern. Is MLB2K8 online playable? "Yes it is" is it a great online experience as it is offline "No it's not"

Now once the online user control pitching/swinging delay response has been corrected then all is well. But until it's addressed I would have to say it will be hard to take online leagues, tournaments, Ranked, and Unranked games really seriously.

[eastcoastcrushr]

The whole premise to baseball is pitch recognition, infortunatly swinging before ball leaves pitchers hand cuts that put. Real baseball feel is what I want, not the current garbage we have. I do think the patch will clear itup though. Let's see.

[jdeszcz]

Is MLB2K8 online playable? "Yes it is" is it a great online experience as it is offline "No it's not".

Honestly this sums it up perfectly. I've read the argument hundreds of times now stating that MLB 2K8 is indeed playable online, and I agree with that, but the experience sucks. I think my biggest problem is that I seem to play a game and get adjusted to the lag issues, but then the next game I play the lag seems to be either slightly worse or slightly better, thus the timing I had down is now off.

Also what blows my mind is I've not tried to play about a dozen games online...and every time my opponent has quite midway through and I would guess part of it is due to they were losing, but also part of it is due to the simple frustration of the lag.

[jdeszcz]

online is playable stfu and practice damnit

How do you practice? Surely you don't mean practice offline because it's a different experience. As for practicing online...some people would prefer to just hop on and be able to play with the premise being that they've gotten their practice in offline and want to try their skills out against somebody else.

[jeffy777]

Is MLB2K8 online playable? "Yes it is" is it a great online experience as it is offline "No it's not"

Exactly. It's not even close to to "great".

2K7 had much smoother online play, and the batting in 2K7 was also extremely timing based (what baseball game doesn't have timing based batting?). I just don't understand why the batting is so laggy in 2K8.

The offfline play is great, but many people buy to play mainly online, and unless this gets fixed, a lot of people just won't buy.

[Temmpus]

Do you know if they updated the rosters for MLB 2k7?

[cscott1202]

i need help it will not let me online i keep on getting this message saying sry we can not sign you into xbox live please try again later. its only doing this for mlb 2k8 i can play other 2k games hell i can even play mlb 2k7 but when i try to get on 2k8 it will not let me

[Temmpus]

is this happening now?

[cscott1202]

no the past couple of days i havnt tried today

[Temmpus]

Well, why would you post it now? Post it when's it's happening.

[cscott1202]

shut up ******* its been happening and im trying to figure out if anybody is havin this problem

[Temmpus]

A lot of things have been happening. Doesn't mean it's happening now. Go check and then post again.

[PHILBOT3000]

If this isn't fixed asap, I'm going to have to return the game. Last year's online mode was fine, what the hell happened? Some may consider it playable, I don't...

[JNC]

I completely disagree with anyone who say's that online is playable right now. no matter what their record is. These people with good records have simply managed to deal with the sheer problems while playing people who haven't.

The reasons I disagree with these people is simple enough:

#1. MLB 2K8 was not in FACT made to be playing the way it is online right now. It should be as close as possible to the offline experience (not perfect but close as any online game will experience latency at some point but not consistently) Some people say you need to get use to not depending on your batter's eye but it wouldn't be in the game if it wasn't suppose to be used.

#2 MLB 2K7 works far better then MLB 2K8 online post-patch. MLB 2K7 has a little latency issues but manages to mimick the offline experience far more greatly then MLB 2K8 while holding a steady framerate and using better graphics. I can't remember what the patch resolved for MLB 2K7 but I don't remember it being a VIP issue. I could be wrong on that though!

The Online experience is simply crap right now...I refuse to let anyone try and tell me it works because it doesn't. I'm not buying into that nonsense. Take Two has put some fantastic features into this game and I love it...but online, I hate it. I know all developers out there feel they need to outdo themselves every year. However, that just goes back to the old saying of "if it ain't broke, don't fix it". After last years game I didn't think a baseball game could get any better...but with the new features like the swing stick 2.0 and the new pitching mechanic it did...but with the framerate issue and the cut scenes being so horrible along with a few other menu things they changed as well as some graphics being less crisp...the game went backwards. Its really a shame and a pitty.

[jeffy777]

Bump Ronnie
[Forum it belongs in: "MLB 2K8 Issues and Concerns"]

[jeffy777]

I like the offline play, but I truly can't believe they released a game that plays this poorly online.....and that they are promoting a big Live weekend while the game in this current laggy condition.

Look at game such as CoD4 and Forza 2: both games are heavily dependent on timing and fast movement. So if those games can play lag-free, I don't understand why a baseball game can't play smoothly in terms of lag.

[Temmpus]

Hopefully the patch will fix the online lag . . . if not . . . oh well. Not much you can do about it. It's not like you have a choice.

[sleepytercel]

I like the offline play, but I truly can't believe they released a game that plays this poorly online.....and that they are promoting a big Live weekend while the game in this current laggy condition.

Look at game such as CoD4 and Forza 2: both games are heavily dependent on timing and fast movement. So if those games can play lag-free, I don't understand why a baseball game can't play smoothly in terms of lag.

The way those games work are different than how sports games work. In a sports game, you are completely synced up together. Each command is being downloaded/uploaded to the users at the same time. However, games like COD4 and Forza, you're actually playing independent. When you're driving, the actual movement and what you see is only dependent on your machine.

The servers in those games react by "updating" where the other users are on screen. Lag in those games cause "skipping" or "warping". If there's a laggy game in COD4, you'll see the same thing, and reaction to what someone does will be delayed. For instance, when you throw a grenade, you may see a pause before the grenade launches since it has to match up with everyone else. If you're shooting someone, you may see a delayed reaction to your bullets making contact since it has to sync. However, it doesn't affect your movement while running around the map since it's only dependent on your machine.

MLB2K8 must sync every single event and movement together and is relient to do so within the two servers working together. Make sense?

[jeffy777]

Yeah, that makes since, but what doesn't make since is why 2K8's net code seems so crappy compared to 2K7....

I realize that the pitching mechanic is more delicate this year.....but it would make sense if the circle meter was synced on your screen with what you were actually doing with the controller. Offline it is, but online it isn't. Atleast in 2K7, the pitching meter was synced up on the pitcher's screen with the timing of when the button was pressed for effectiveness and release. In 2K8, the release timing seems way off.

Also, the batting in 2K7 was based just as much on timing as it is in 2K8, yet the online batting in 2K8 is nowhere near as smooth as it was in 2K7.

Seems like the controls took a step forward, but the net code took a step back.

[sleepytercel]

Yeah, that makes since, but what doesn't make since is why 2K8's net code seems so crappy compared to 2K7....

When 2K7 was released, there were lag issues that a large amount of people were complaining about. I also think some of the core changes in 2K8 that were sloppy effect the game as well. For instance, when playing offline in 2K8, there's still a loading stutter in-between batter cutscenes. In 2K7, the transitions were smooth. When taken online, this batter stutter causes issues with the server like "waiting for opponent" screens. This didn't happen in 2K7 because no such stutter existed. The lag issues were bad in 2K7 upon release, but were ironed out later. Mechanical changes in a game could affect how the server reacts. For instance, there may be more calculations being placed in 2K8 which causes a latency in how the server delivers them to the users. These things are usually deeper than what they seem.

[Temmpus]

So you're saying that the upcoming patch, which is supposed to fix some of the framrate issues, will translate to a fix for online play?

[jeffy777]

Mechanical changes in a game could affect how the server reacts. For instance, there may be more calculations being placed in 2K8 which causes a latency in how the server delivers them to the users. These things are usually deeper than what they seem.

So the diagnosis is clear: there's an obvious problem.

The question is: Will 2K fix it or leave us with a crappy online experience? That remains to be seen....

[sleepytercel]

So you're saying that the upcoming patch, which is supposed to fix some of the framrate issues, will translate to a fix for online play?

I'm not saying that for sure, so I wouldn't completely be assured of that. However, stability fixes can surely improve performance.

[IBBALLIN33]

this game is compleltely overrated!

[sleepytercel]

this game is compleltely overrated!

I don't think you've been in these forums enough.

[Temmpus]

I'm not saying that for sure, so I wouldn't completely be assured of that. However, stability fixes can surely improve performance.

But wasn't the patch tested before it was sent to MS? Surely they would have tested the patch before submitting it to be sure that it works. It's not like 2k would release something without having tested it first, right? So, they must know if it fixed the online lag or not. Right? Am I out of line here or is this a legitimate question?

[sleepytercel]

But wasn't the patch tested before it was sent to MS? Surely they would have tested the patch before submitting it to be sure that it works. It's not like 2k would release something without having tested it first, right? So, they must know if it fixed the online lag or not. Right? Am I out of line here or is this a legitimate question?

How would they test the online portion of the game when the community is not using it?

[jeffy777]

Seems like a legit question to me. They should just be up front with us instead of getting our hopes up if the online is going to improve or not.

[Temmpus]

Oh, sorry. I wasn't aware that the testers did not have access to the internet and thus would not be able to test the game online. I apologize.

[jeffy777]

How would they test the online portion of the game when the community is not using it?

Don't they have the technology to test it "in house"? You would think that before a game was released that they would test the online portion of it (or alteast have the ability to do so), certainly before the community tries it.......the same should be true for a patch.

If not, that would just being asking for disaster: releasing something that hasn't even been tested online.

[sleepytercel]

Oh, sorry. I wasn't aware that the testers did not have access to the internet and thus would not be able to test the game online. I apologize.

How could they be so sure that it will react exactly the same compared to what is running when 1000's of people are on that server? No reason for the sarcasm, I'm trying to help.

[Temmpus]

Don't they have the technology to test it "in house"? You would think that before a game was released that they would test the online portion of it (or alteast have the ability to do so), certainly before the community tries it.......the same should be true for a patch.

You're making an assumption that they have access to the internet. Maybe they don't. Don't you think it's possible that a big gaming company like Take Two maybe can't afford to pay for high speed internet? We are in a recession, don't you know?

[jeffy777]

How could they be so sure that it will react exactly the same compared to what is running when 1000's of people are on that server?

Well, this is the problem that all game companies are faced with when they release a game, and that's usually why they try to do as much testing as possible before release.

Some companies do a very good job of dealing with this problem. Unfortunately for us, 2K did a bad job of it this year.

I haven't given up hope that they will fix it, but I'm still shocked that it's this bad, and they released it like it is now.

[Temmpus]

How could they be so sure that it will react exactly the same compared to what is running when 1000's of people are on that server? No reason for the sarcasm, I'm trying to help.
Wasn't trying to be sarcastic. But, honestly, is there any legitimate reason why they would not have been able to test the game online before they shipped it out? And Isn't reasonable to expect that they would test the patch for online play before they sent it to MS? Just making a point.

Now, from this statement you're leading me to believe that it's a server problem. If that's the case they just need to upgrade the servers. And that, my friends, costs big MONEY. Which means that no patch will be able to fix the online issues. Now, I doubt that any big gaming company which touts it's online leagues and online play as a major part of their sports games would admit that their servers are not adequate enough to handle the thousands of players trying to use them. But it would be nice to be told the truth . . . now and then.

[sleepytercel]

Well, this is the problem that all game companies are faced with when they release a game, and that's usually why they try to do as much testing as possible before release.

Some companies do a very good job of dealing with this problem. Unfortunately for us, 2K did a bad job of it this year.

I haven't given up hope that they will fix it, but I'm still shocked that it's this bad, and they released it like it is now.

You may be right, but even Sony's baseball game suffers extreme latency issues as it's one of its top complaints. Whether they fixed it or not, I am unsure, but many online baseball titles have always seemed to suffer lag. Also, there are plenty of games that came out that had online issues that weren't known until the game released. Many of those games have online improvements. There's many reports that a certain game may play great online before release, but after the game comes out, the servers aren't like they were with the beta releases.

[sleepytercel]

Wasn't trying to be sarcastic. But, honestly, is there any legitimate reason why they would not have been able to test the game online before they shipped it out? And Isn't reasonable to expect that they would test the patch for online play before they sent it to MS? Just making a point.

Now, from this statement you're leading me to believe that it's a server problem. If that's the case they just need to upgrade the servers. And that, my friends, costs big MONEY. Which means that no patch will be able to fix the online issues. Now, I doubt that any big gaming company which touts it's online leagues and online play as a major part of their sports games would admit that their servers are not adequate enough to handle the thousands of players trying to use them. But it would be nice to be told the truth . . . now and then.

Well, I'm not part of the development team, and can only offer what I know. I don't know if it is exactly server related, or if it's code related, or if it is both. I'll be playing the "wait and see" game that we all will be. I hope it improves, just like everyone else.

[jeffy777]

I didn't play 2K7 until after they patched it, but I thought the online was a pretty good experience.....especially compared to 2K8.

You said 2K7 was more laggy at first. If they can fix 2K7, they should be able to fix 2K8.....

I just hope they don't let us down.

[sleepytercel]

I hope as well. It is a top concern reported to Ronnie and I do know that the information was passed.

[Temmpus]

Well, I'm not part of the development team, and can only offer what I know. I don't know if it is exactly server related, or if it's code related, or if it is both. I'll be playing the "wait and see" game that we all will be. I hope it improves, just like everyone else.

Ok, I thought you had a direct line to the development team. Sorry.

[thaSLAB]

You may be right, but even Sony's baseball game suffers extreme latency issues as it's one of its top complaints. Whether they fixed it or not, I am unsure, but many online baseball titles have always seemed to suffer lag. Also, there are plenty of games that came out that had online issues that weren't known until the game released. Many of those games have online improvements. There's many reports that a certain game may play great online before release, but after the game comes out, the servers aren't like they were with the beta releases.

SONY's game is p2p, so latency is pretty much dependent on each player's connection. I heard there were problems last year (I played 2K7 last year) that required a patch, but I think online it is very good so far this year. Again, that is mainly me hosting games on my connection, but even if someone else hosts, its pretty good.

Anyway, I know the topic here is 2K online, so i'll hush...

[Temmpus]

So The Show plays fine online? Do they have leagues and tournaments too?