Evil but legal. >:)

[Numbski]

Okay, so I'm messing around with my lineups - and as most of you know, I play a defensively stacked squad. I tweaked it a bit this morning, giving me this:

Gold:
Willie Brown - FS
Mark Smith - CB

Silver:
Lem Barney - CB
D ick Anderson - SS
Joey Browner - SS

Bronze:
Jim Harbaugh - QB
Christian Okoye - HB
Scott Studwell - ILB
Robert Brazille - OLB
Dave Butz - DT
Dexter Manley - DE

The main switch is that I went from a Silver DT to a second Silver SS. Before my second SS was Charlie Waters, and I had Millard at DT.

ANYWAY - what about this is evil but legal??? Well....your special teams have a strong safety. :) In my depth chart, Joey Browner is the second strong safety. On punt formations, he is one of the blockers out wide that blocks the gunners.

This wouldn't be so noteworth, except for the minor fact that Browner's abilities are flat out AWESOME for this task:

Big Hit
Footsteps
Wrap-Up Tackler
Run Coverage
Strength Bonus

Now you tell me - if you HAD to pick someone to block the gunner, and then go bring down the punt returner, who would *you* choose? ;)

Here's the thing. I've played parts of 4 games this morning - I got rated negative twice, and neutral twice. All 4 claimed I was using an out-of-position substitution (I clearly was not), and 3 times someone went to catch the punt with their star returner when they should have called for a fair catch - and each time apparently Joey's "footsteps" were heard. They bobbled the punt, and I got a free 6.

So far as I can tell, this is NOT cheese. I'm not cheating, I'm not using an out-of-position substitution. An extra plus is that he is in on on-side kick returns (the 4th negative was because he basically ran over two guys to recover the football), and can be subbed in on kickoffs, as his strength bonus makes for good blocking, but I guess this would be borderline cheese, because that safety spot is supposed to be a Free Safety, not a Strong Safety. Seems legit to me - but hey.

Just wanted to point it out. It wasn't intentional at first, but now that I have him out there, it *really* forces the other guy to be honest about whether or not to let that punt bounce rather than try to catch it. ;)

[amid]

but now that I have him out there, it *really* forces the other guy to be honest about whether or not to let that punt bounce rather than try to catch it. ;)
i have had willy wood, lem barney and other returners fumble many punts. i have called fair catch and watched the punt hit gold players right on top of their helmets. if you see me run from punts, it is not because i have fear of your players, i have fear of mine.

[Codenamemighty]

Its a good thing for you..But to me I can play an all defensive team and still score and win big...But I do like your determination for playing defense

[pats3912]

Okay, so I'm messing around with my lineups - and as most of you know, I play a defensively stacked squad. I tweaked it a bit this morning, giving me this:

Gold:
Willie Brown - FS
Mark Smith - CB

Silver:
Lem Barney - CB
D ick Anderson - SS
Joey Browner - SS

Bronze:
Jim Harbaugh - QB
Christian Okoye - HB
Scott Studwell - ILB
Robert Brazille - OLB
Dave Butz - DT
Dexter Manley - DE

The main switch is that I went from a Silver DT to a second Silver SS. Before my second SS was Charlie Waters, and I had Millard at DT.

ANYWAY - what about this is evil but legal??? Well....your special teams have a strong safety. :) In my depth chart, Joey Browner is the second strong safety. On punt formations, he is one of the blockers out wide that blocks the gunners.

This wouldn't be so noteworth, except for the minor fact that Browner's abilities are flat out AWESOME for this task:

Big Hit
Footsteps
Wrap-Up Tackler
Run Coverage
Strength Bonus

Now you tell me - if you HAD to pick someone to block the gunner, and then go bring down the punt returner, who would *you* choose? ;)

Here's the thing. I've played parts of 4 games this morning - I got rated negative twice, and neutral twice. All 4 claimed I was using an out-of-position substitution (I clearly was not), and 3 times someone went to catch the punt with their star returner when they should have called for a fair catch - and each time apparently Joey's "footsteps" were heard. They bobbled the punt, and I got a free 6.

So far as I can tell, this is NOT cheese. I'm not cheating, I'm not using an out-of-position substitution. An extra plus is that he is in on on-side kick returns (the 4th negative was because he basically ran over two guys to recover the football), and can be subbed in on kickoffs, as his strength bonus makes for good blocking, but I guess this would be borderline cheese, because that safety spot is supposed to be a Free Safety, not a Strong Safety. Seems legit to me - but hey.

Just wanted to point it out. It wasn't intentional at first, but now that I have him out there, it *really* forces the other guy to be honest about whether or not to let that punt bounce rather than try to catch it. ;)

Players in the NFL are used out of position all the time. Troy brown has played WR, CB, and even QB once when the team was way ahead. In real life, if a coach feels that one of recievers can play as an effective DB, do you think the coach isnt gonna use him out of position just because the other coach's will whine and cry and say its cheese? Please, c'mon! As long as your not relying on a glitch in the game and following the rules of the game its not cheese to make lineup adjustments to win a game. thats the whole purpose of being a creative coach and gameplanning. Use your advantages if you can find em.

[nyknicks33]

nothing earth shattering about that..if you have duplicate players at a position, the 2nd string guy is going to play special teams..like when I have 3 OLB's..say, Thomas, Loyd, Carl Banks., Banks is going to be running down field like a maniac on kick coverage looking to big hit someone.

[nyknicks33]

i have had willy wood, lem barney and other returners fumble many punts. i have called fair catch and watched the punt hit gold players right on top of their helmets. if you see me run from punts, it is not because i have fear of your players, i have fear of mine.


True, if my returner has to move more then 10 yards in any direction to catch the ball on the fly, I just let it bounce and take my chances with the roll.

[Numbski]

Yeah - well two of these guys had gold returners - Cliff (can't recall his last name, FS), and Mark Smith, and then the other had Lem Barney. Near range, Browner bearing down on them as they caught the ball, I guess hoping he'd miss or something. I was just going to tackle, not click the right stick for a big hit (didn't want to risk pulling a charged up statue of liberty), but it didn't matter. Footsteps ruled the day. ;)

[nyknicks33]

Speaking of the artist formerly known as Mike Haynes..I once had a CB tandem of Mark Smith and Willie Brown..that was lots of fun.

[nyknicks33]

Okay, so I'm messing around with my lineups - and as most of you know, I play a defensively stacked squad. I tweaked it a bit this morning, giving me this:

Gold:
Willie Brown - FS
Mark Smith - CB

Silver:
Lem Barney - CB
D ick Anderson - SS
Joey Browner - SS

Bronze:
Jim Harbaugh - QB
Christian Okoye - HB
Scott Studwell - ILB
Robert Brazille - OLB
Dave Butz - DT
Dexter Manley - DE



Butz isnt bad..try clyde simmons and put him at DT. He's big enough to play in the middle in this game, and he can bull or club his way past the center and right to the QB's face

[Numbski]

Yeah, I screwed up. It's Willie Wood I have at FS, not Willie Brown. Ooops!

Mike Haynes seems like the most stable CB in the game, and I've tried them all. He's always in position to make a play on the ball. He's not gotten a single pick for me, but I don't care. Stay on those Gold WR's when they put a double move on - and he does that. Knock it down all day for all I care, just don't let them catch it!

I'd prefer not to move anyone out of position just to avoid whining. Maybe I'll try Simmons in a practice game, see how he does.

[nflhitman]

I have gotten the negative feedback also when I had Legends on Special Teams. I did this on purpose because I was getting tired of everyone including Generics returning the ball to at least the 40 or beyond. This was the big issue for many friends I played so I took it off even though my Seahawks have Starters in on Special Teams. I had Joey Browner as my Gunner and I would pop the **** out of the returner and make them fumble :)

[GoodSense]

Players in the NFL are used out of position all the time. Troy brown has played WR, CB, and even QB once when the team was way ahead. In real life, if a coach feels that one of recievers can play as an effective DB, do you think the coach isnt gonna use him out of position just because the other coach's will whine and cry and say its cheese? Please, c'mon! As long as your not relying on a glitch in the game and following the rules of the game its not cheese to make lineup adjustments to win a game. thats the whole purpose of being a creative coach and gameplanning. Use your advantages if you can find em.

Personally speaking, I see nothing wrong with his lineup. So let me get this out of the way.

True, but this is what I was referring to before.
This board use to light up against players putting in people out of position and it wasn't based on a glitch.

Once an out of position is excepted then there is no room to complain if someone plays someone who puts Sanders/Earl in at QB and runs all day.

I know people will say, "But they never played at that position."
But that is not the issue any longer because it seems people are moving more towards this trend or justifying this trend.
Can't have it both ways.


It sucks because development doesn't take into account the possibilities of the customizations they allow in the game and how the gamer might use them.
Without doing this it just simply does not represent the true representation/abilities of that "substitution" in that position. Some players have switched, but many do not just jump back and forth with success because the positions are entirely different.
The WR to DB or DB to WR switch normally works because they are not moving to a primary position. Either the WR is 3rd or 4th with 2 other primary receivers a team needs to cover or as DB they are not covering a Owens, Moss, or Johnson.

I wouldn't complain about a person playing out of position.

[nyknicks33]

Yeah, I screwed up. It's Willie Wood I have at FS, not Willie Brown. Ooops!

Mike Haynes seems like the most stable CB in the game, and I've tried them all. He's always in position to make a play on the ball. He's not gotten a single pick for me, but I don't care. Stay on those Gold WR's when they put a double move on - and he does that. Knock it down all day for all I care, just don't let them catch it!

I'd prefer not to move anyone out of position just to avoid whining. Maybe I'll try Simmons in a practice game, see how he does.

Yes he did, he got a pick when I threw to cliff branch in the deep corner of the endzone in our game the other day.

thats where the 1 on 1 match up was, so I went to it and he won that round. That turned out to be the difference in the game as you won 21-14

[MINATAURO]

Joey Browner is a BEAST!!!!!!! By the way I don't think your lineup is cheese.

[Khan Lives]

There's nothing wrong with that. Just like I have 3 legend OLbs and on special teams, 1 of them is running down field.

[Numbski]

Yes he did, he got a pick when I threw to cliff branch in the deep corner of the endzone in our game the other day.

thats where the 1 on 1 match up was, so I went to it and he won that round. That turned out to be the difference in the game as you won 21-14

Huh. I thought it was Willie Wood that got the INT. Oh well. :) I forgot. Point is, he's VERY stable. He doesn't tend to do anything spectacular, but he DOES stay with his man.

[totalownership]

Ok numb you know we gotta play now. I gotta see this super team of yours up close. ;)

[Valdarez]

It's a tough defense, but you can still score on it. Problem the heavy D leaves Numbski in a bind on big play ability. I have played against all D teams before with good players, and you can still score if you call the right O Plays against the wrong D plays. I still believe the best approach is a balanced one where you have Passing + Running threats, and a strong secondary / mid field (DLine seems too weak in the game).

[totalownership]

It's a tough defense, but you can still score on it.
I know ;) aint that right numb? lol

[Numbski]

Ugh. I've said it before, I'll say it again:

9 stars on defense == 9 chances for someone to do something monumentally stupid in coverage.

[nyknicks33]

Ugh. I've said it before, I'll say it again:

9 stars on defense == 9 chances for someone to do something monumentally stupid in coverage.


I think the people who cry about your team, or leave you negative feedback..are those people who simply refuse to make reads.

You just have to be disciplined and look to where the 1 on 1 matchup is..sometimes the reciever will win it, sometimes he wont...like that Mark Smith on Cliff Branch play. That wasnt my 1st read, but he was one on one so I figured a 50-50 shot is miles better then forcing the ball into coverage.

[ElGreazy78]

Okay, so I'm messing around with my lineups - and as most of you know, I play a defensively stacked squad. I tweaked it a bit this morning, giving me this:

Gold:
Willie Brown - FS
Mark Smith - CB

Silver:
Lem Barney - CB
D ick Anderson - SS
Joey Browner - SS
I see no problem with Legends on Special Teams because players in real life will play ST's but my question is, what kind of defense do you run? (I recall playing you but don't remember your defense.) If you have one of your Safeties at LB then, yes, I'll take exception and probably leave neutral but if you're playing mainly Nickel & Dime packages, I see no problem with it. I've witnesses first hand that Browner is all too powerful when being subbed in as an OLB.

[AlexJones27]

I've had an all secondary team before. All you have to do is force a 3rd down somehow and force a passing situation and your unstoppable.

[Numbski]

Very true. So far as Joey Browner goes, I use him functionally as a linebacker, but he is in a pre-set SS position. I typically run a 3-2, and the formations I use have him down in the box. He might as well be an OLB, but he's not. :)

I will on VERY rare occassion go to a 3-4 in order to meet a specific need (maybe one play every few games or so) and in that case, I confess - I do have him subbed in at OLB. I don't abuse it, I assure you, but it's usually to shut down Ben Coates, and there are a couple of formations that put Browner, Anderson, and Brazille on him, and that's how I accomplish it.