How did you score the fight before kd? Marg vs cotto

[BANKY]

I had it 96-94 for Margo at time of stoppage. I'll post Warp, if anyone knows Warp here, and you guys can give him crap for his scorecard, which is absolutely a farce. Have to rub this one in your face, warp, lmao.

http://www.fightjudge.com/user/Warp/364/scorecard.png
How do you give Cotto so many rounds, what the hell did you see that noone else did, save for the nuthuggers?

[nickelzdropdimes]

i think he gave rds because of Cotto's flash....he didnt see or think much of AM's body work.....


IMO Cotto lost rds because of ringmanship..he never controlled the fight which is what you, me, and the real judges saw... the 2nd rd really help change momentum.....

[korey1980]

I had it 96-94 for Margo at time of stoppage. I'll post Warp, if anyone knows Warp here, and you guys can give him crap for his scorecard, which is absolutely a farce. Have to rub this one in your face, warp, lmao.

http://www.fightjudge.com/user/Warp/364/scorecard.png
How do you give Cotto so many rounds, what the hell did you see that noone else did, save for the nuthuggers?

98-93 for Cotto is ridiculous. Is Warps real name Jerry Roth(who scored Tito beating Oscar)? At best it couldve been tied up, but I scored it right on with your score. Margo was landing the harder shots which gave him the lead(imo). He hurt Cotto in round 2, and from then on I scored the fight based mostly on who I thought was doing more damage. I love Cotto, but he was losing at the time of the knockout(imo), hints the damage done by Margo to Cottos face. 98-93, pssssshhhh, get a clue!!

[bigfnjoe96]

I had the fight even after 10 rounds with a strong thought that Margo if anything would knock Cotto down in the 11th. Cotto was really hurt by Margo in those last 15-20 seconds of round 10 & you could see that when Cotto walked back to his corner

[TDEEZY58]

I had it even, but you could tell Cotto was starting to fade a little. Antonio was landing more and Cotto was moving a lot less.

[kcxiv]

One thing i learned in boxing is that people ONLY see the head shots. They just totally ignore the body shots for some reason. Marg landed tons and tons of bodyshots throughout every round. Lampley didnt hardly even mention it ever. Its like he totally ignored that Marg was covering up his chin and body and firing at the body. All i heard was Marg keeps throwing but not landing. I was like, wtf? Is he watching the same fight i am.

[kcxiv]

I had the fight even after 10 rounds with a strong thought that Margo if anything would knock Cotto down in the 11th. Cotto was really hurt by Margo in those last 15-20 seconds of round 10 & you could see that when Cotto walked back to his corner
I think Cotto was hurt in the 2nd round by a body shot. He was sitting on the ropes after a body shot. ITs at about the 148 mark.

[reppa]

One thing i learned in boxing is that people ONLY see the head shots. They just totally ignore the body shots for some reason. Marg landed tons and tons of bodyshots throughout every round. Lampley didnt hardly even mention it ever. Its like he totally ignored that Marg was covering up his chin and body and firing at the body. All i heard was Marg keeps throwing but not landing. I was like, wtf? Is he watching the same fight i am.


:rotfl: LMAO at that **it in bold right there. I said the same thing.

[Charlie Murphy]

I think I had it 6-4 Margarito going into the 11th round, don't quote me on that though as I'm not 100% sure lol.

[Charlie Murphy]

actually no, I think I had it 5-5....I think lol

[pipioz]

I am a Cotto fan, but I had Cotto losing the fight because Margarito was controlling the ring since round 2. That scorecard = Cotto blind homer

[warp]

I had it 96-94 for Margo at time of stoppage. I'll post Warp, if anyone knows Warp here, and you guys can give him crap for his scorecard, which is absolutely a farce. Have to rub this one in your face, warp, lmao.

http://www.fightjudge.com/user/Warp/364/scorecard.png
How do you give Cotto so many rounds, what the hell did you see that noone else did, save for the nuthuggers?

I think it's without doubt that the first 6 rounds are right. Rewatching right after the fight (haven't caught the replay tonight) I had it 97-94, but at worst it could be 96-94.

And lol losing. Just because Cotto wasn't hurting Margarito, Cotto's landing like 6 shots in a row on Margarito's heads in the earlier rounds. Margarito's shots were landing on Cotto's gloves when they landed. They were partially "blocked" and then they landed. Cotto was landing clean and flush.

Round 6, a lot of people give this round to Margarito, why? Margarito really walks him down, but he misses with most of his shots. Around 1:40 Cotto lands a good flurry. Margarito's shots are being blocked with the gloves and in the meantime Cotto is sneaking in right hands. In the last 30 seconds Cotto lands some really good jabs. I mean Margarito is really adding up the damage. Round 7 clearly shows this and so does round 11, but that does not justify him winning round 6.

Round 10, Margarito hurt Cotto very bad in the last ten seconds, but was it enough to win the round. Cotto was using good movement and landing clean shots and then Margarito ****s Cotto up big time. I scored it even, but it could be for Margarito.

I give Margarito credit, he was slowly punishing Cotto, but it wasn't enough to win him the rounds. Besides, just because it has a wide scorecard, doesn't mean I thought it was a close fight. It's not like Cotto was dominating. He was just doing better work in the rounds to take them.

[warp]

Oh by the way, I'm not that big of a fan on Cotto. I perfer watching more of boxers (Mijares, Hopkins, Mayweather) then sluggers like Cotto.

My favorite fighters:

1. Bernard Hopkins
2. Cristian Mijares
3. Floyd Mayweather jr
4. Juan Manuel Marquez
5. Hozumi Hasegawa

Others no order:
-Joe Calzaghe
-Kelly Pavlik
-Israel Vasquez
-Oscar De La Hoya
-Nonito Donaire
-Rafael Marquez
-Juan Manuel Lopez
-Roy Jones (prime)
-Winky Wright
-Miguel Cotto
-Shane Mosley

Past timers:
-Aaron Pryor
-Charley Burley
-Sugar Ray Robinson
-Marvin Hagler
-Billy Conn

edit: Oh and having it 96-94 for Margarito is just as "bad" as having it 97-93 (if you give the even round to Margarito) for Cotto. You don't score on agression and if Cotto was "running" away from Margarito. You score on who lands CLEAN punches. Margarito's punches were being partially (in most rounds. Not rounds like 2 and then also 7 where he ripped cotto a new one) as in they weren't landing flush on Cotto's face/body as Cotto's shots were.

By the way what was your score on Soto-Guzman?

[reppa]

Night of the fight I had it even going into the 11th, but on the replay I had Marg up 6-4. I had to ask myself a few times if Lampley was watching the same fight as I was. He says Marg was not landing the punishing blows, but even on the inbetween replays, you could see the shots connecting. Most people did not give Marg a shot to win if it went the distance, but this does prove otherwise.

[AntDawg]

I think it's without doubt that the first 6 rounds are right. Rewatching right after the fight (haven't caught the replay tonight) I had it 97-94, but at worst it could be 96-94.

And lol losing. Just because Cotto wasn't hurting Margarito, Cotto's landing like 6 shots in a row on Margarito's heads in the earlier rounds. Margarito's shots were landing on Cotto's gloves when they landed. They were partially "blocked" and then they landed. Cotto was landing clean and flush.

Round 6, a lot of people give this round to Margarito, why? Margarito really walks him down, but he misses with most of his shots. Around 1:40 Cotto lands a good flurry. Margarito's shots are being blocked with the gloves and in the meantime Cotto is sneaking in right hands. In the last 30 seconds Cotto lands some really good jabs. I mean Margarito is really adding up the damage. Round 7 clearly shows this and so does round 11, but that does not justify him winning round 6.

Round 10, Margarito hurt Cotto very bad in the last ten seconds, but was it enough to win the round. Cotto was using good movement and landing clean shots and then Margarito ****s Cotto up big time. I scored it even, but it could be for Margarito.

I give Margarito credit, he was slowly punishing Cotto, but it wasn't enough to win him the rounds. Besides, just because it has a wide scorecard, doesn't mean I thought it was a close fight. It's not like Cotto was dominating. He was just doing better work in the rounds to take them.

YES!!!!!! For me I don't care how much you get hit if you hurt the other guy badly you won the round for me since that would be the most effective punches.

[reppa]

YES!!!!!! For me I don't care how much you get hit if you hurt the other guy badly you won the round for me since that would be the most effective punches.

:thumbsup: Agreed. I haven't thought about that till now, but I agree with that. Over the years I have realized that there is a lot more to boxing than just 2 guys punching each other. To be honest, even the last few fights I have watched have made me look at rounds different. Mainly because of the type of fights we have had recently, but there really is a lot of things to look for in a given round to determine the winner of that round.....let alone the overall fight. And a lot of times with the judges, it comes down to what type of style they favor more.

[BANKY]

Oh by the way, I'm not that big of a fan on Cotto. I perfer watching more of boxers (Mijares, Hopkins, Mayweather) then sluggers like Cotto.

My favorite fighters:

1. Bernard Hopkins
2. Cristian Mijares
3. Floyd Mayweather jr
4. Juan Manuel Marquez
5. Hozumi Hasegawa

Others no order:
-Joe Calzaghe
-Kelly Pavlik
-Israel Vasquez
-Oscar De La Hoya
-Nonito Donaire
-Rafael Marquez
-Juan Manuel Lopez
-Roy Jones (prime)
-Winky Wright
-Miguel Cotto
-Shane Mosley

Past timers:
-Aaron Pryor
-Charley Burley
-Sugar Ray Robinson
-Marvin Hagler
-Billy Conn

edit: Oh and having it 96-94 for Margarito is just as "bad" as having it 97-93 (if you give the even round to Margarito) for Cotto. You don't score on agression and if Cotto was "running" away from Margarito. You score on who lands CLEAN punches. Margarito's punches were being partially (in most rounds. Not rounds like 2 and then also 7 where he ripped cotto a new one) as in they weren't landing flush on Cotto's face/body as Cotto's shots were.

By the way what was your score on Soto-Guzman?
So, having it 96-94 for margarito is BAD?! LMAO, warp, i gotta give you crap, your scorecard was biased as all hell. Considering two judges had it that exact same score, i can see how you thought that, lmao. It's true that you were biased, look at your favorite fighters, you like guys who are technical, stick and move. I mean, hopkins, may, mijares? That says all you need to know. So, you like the guys that move. You would rather watch someone run than fight, i get it bro, i really do. you had it 98-93 on fight night and then only concede to 97-94?

I thought you said you knew boxing? Well, cmon, be a bigger man and admit you were wrong. That sometimes moving isn't as effective as effective aggression.

Be a man and own up, you were wrong, just plain wrong.

This just goes to show that you didn't care for the aggressiveness of Margarito. You felt he missed too many shots. The shots he did land with were glancing at best. Well, you were wrong on all accounts. The aggressiveness was what worked. He didn't miss with too many shots, as compubox numbers pointed out. And those glancing shots, well, they were good enough to KO cotto in the end.

I thought for sure you would come in here and say you were wrong and be a man about it, but cmon, quit defending that card.

[warp]

Question: How was Margarito's agression so "effective" if Cotto was staying on the ropes on purpose. He never actually forced Cotto to the ropes. Cotto was always on the backfoot from round 1. I consider Effective agression cutting off the ring and trapping and pumpeling etc. like what Margarito did in round 7. Cotto basically stayed on the ropes. You still score clean shots over effective agression anyway.

So, having it 96-94 for margarito is BAD?! LMAO, warp, i gotta give you crap, your scorecard was biased as all hell. Considering two judges had it that exact same score, i can see how you thought that, lmao. It's true that you were biased, look at your favorite fighters, you like guys who are technical, stick and move. I mean, hopkins, may, mijares? That says all you need to know. So, you like the guys that move. You would rather watch someone run than fight, i get it bro, i really do. you had it 98-93 on fight night and then only concede to 97-94?

Are you kidding me? Do you know which two judges had it for Margarito:
Glen Hamada: Only found to give one round to Zab Judah against Mayweather.
Jerry Roth: Scored it for Trinidad against De La Hoya...

I like watching fighters who stick and move yes, but you have to score on clean punches. Also they don't run. Especially Mijares. What the hell? Have you ever watched Cristian Mijares fight? He sticks and moves, but Mijares is the perfect combonation of boxer-puncher. Watch his second fight against Katsugishe Kawashima, that was a war.

Also my favorite fighter from the past is Aaron Pryor, a full out slugger.


This just goes to show that you didn't care for the aggressiveness of Margarito. You felt he missed too many shots. The shots he did land with were glancing at best. Well, you were wrong on all accounts. The aggressiveness was what worked. He didn't miss with too many shots, as compubox numbers pointed out. And those glancing shots, well, they were good enough to KO cotto in the end.

I never said they were glancing. They were being partially blocked. As in they would land and break through Cotto's gloves and hit him. I don't count those as much as clean punches.

Besides I remember you saying you scored Williams-Margarito for Margarito LOL. Don't talk about bad judging when you had that.

[warp]

Look I'm not discrediting Margarito, he did a hell of a job wearing down Cotto and that's all that matters, but when scoring on a round by round basis I think it's not tha unreasonable to have it 97-93 or 96-94 for Cotto. I've explained some rounds like round 6.

I put "bad" in quotes because even though I disagree, I still respect your opinion.

[BANKY]

Look I'm not discrediting Margarito, he did a hell of a job wearing down Cotto and that's all that matters, but when scoring on a round by round basis I think it's not tha unreasonable to have it 97-93 or 96-94 for Cotto. I've explained some rounds like round 6.

I put "bad" in quotes because even though I disagree, I still respect your opinion.
96-94 cotto is not unreasonable. 97-93 isn't even unreasonable.

98-93 is unreasonable. 99-91, also unreasonable. That card belonged to someone i have also been giving crap too.

So, cotto was on the ropes on purpose? Margarito's aggression had nothing to do with that? When have you ever seen Cotto go to the ropes on purpose? You aren't supposed to score clean shots over effective aggression. They are supposed to be judged evenly. Need a link to see that? I can provide if you like my friend.

I'm Mexican, of course i know who Mijares is. I just know that he is a stick and mover and not a face first warrior in the likes of a margarito.

When a punch is partially blocked, doesn't that by definition mean glancing?
glancing:a deflected movement or course; an oblique rebound
Cmon, you said it, you meant it. I can talk about will-marg in a judging sense, because your card of 117-111 was way off too. Mine was actually closer. I had it 115-113 for marg.
You are absolutely disrespecting Margarito. You claim his blows weren't clean. That he isn't boxing that well. That his defense was porous. All the while forgetting that Cotto, is not a boxer, his gameplan is usually more in line with what Margarito does. You should have know something was up when he started going backwards from the opening bell. You should have know that punches thrown off the back foot don't land with as much force as a fighter coming forward. You should have known that if a fighter gets hurt in a round, even if they won the first 2:30 of the round, he loses the round.

The facts, Margarito landed the heavier punches. Most of the Power shots. Cotto landed more jabs, like 60 or 70 more. but Marg landed like 50 more power punches. Marg's body work should mean something, even if it doesn't twist cotto's head back the way marg's head did after cotto's shots. Cotto going backwards, cost him the fight.

Give Marg credit. He is the better boxer and fighter. There is more to boxing than movement, shoulder rolling and defense. If they fought ten times, Margarito would win 9.

Cmon Warp, I have faith that you can see your faults in this.

[TDEEZY58]

That fight was 95-95 after 10 rounds. Margarito was building momentum though. Maybe you could have had for Margarito because of the momentum but on the cards Cotto was in that fight.

97-93 Cotto is way off. I agree that Cotto took 4 of the first 6 rounds. But you had to give the 7th to Antonio, and possibly the 8th, 9th, or 10th. There's no way Cotto won the 8th 9th and 10th rounds.

[warp]

I don't see how you could give round 6 to Margarito. I think Cotto took one of the rouns between 8 and 9. I think it was round 8.

Give those two extra rounds to Cotto, there ya go. 97-93

[reppa]

Round 9 has me confused. I gave it to Marg, but I'm pretty sure Merchant and 2 or 3 of the judges gave it to Cotto. Am I wrong here?

[BANKY]

But you had it 98-93, warp. How do you explain that? 10-10 for the 10th? You didn't see cotto practically done at the end of the 10th like everyone else? Man, i took one look at him after the round and just knew the fight was almost over. I couldn't believe he took as many shots as he did from Marg. marg, even with blows being glancing half the time, beat the bejesus out of cotto.

Cotto took way more damage, surely you don't think that the damage came in only the two rounds he won?

The surest way to score, that I've always been told anyways, "Who took the most damage at the end of the round?" "Who's worse for wear?" so to speak.

Well, Cotto looked the worse for the wear alot bro. Am I judging wrong? Are we judging boxing, a fighting contest or a dancing show? oooo, look, did you see him just get out of the way of that punch? lmao, cmon.

did anyone really think Margarito looked more hurt than cotto at the end of more than 4 or 5 rounds, tops? Anyone?

[warp]

But you had it 98-93, warp. How do you explain that? 10-10 for the 10th? You didn't see cotto practically done at the end of the 10th like everyone else? Man, i took one look at him after the round and just knew the fight was almost over. I couldn't believe he took as many shots as he did from Marg. marg, even with blows being glancing half the time, beat the bejesus out of cotto.

Looking back on round 10, it should be scored for Margarito. I don't think it could be scored for Cotto, but Cotto did land a lot of shots before getting brtualized in round 10. Still I see where people are coming from, but I don't think Cotto's work shouldn't be for not. I won't argue people scoring this round for Margarito and if I didn't score it even, I'd score it for Margarito.

Cotto took way more damage, surely you don't think that the damage came in only the two rounds he won?

Hell noooooooooooooooooo. Just Cotto was doing the better work to win the rounds, while Margarito kept wearing down on Cotto. Cotto landed punches cleanly on Margarito's face, while Margarito's punches landed on Cotto's gloves and then hit him. That's not as clean as Cotto's punches so they don't count for more when scoring.

The surest way to score, that I've always been told anyways, "Who took the most damage at the end of the round?" "Who's worse for wear?" so to speak.

Well, Cotto looked the worse for the wear alot bro. Am I judging wrong? Are we judging boxing, a fighting contest or a dancing show? oooo, look, did you see him just get out of the way of that punch? lmao, cmon.

did anyone really think Margarito looked more hurt than cotto at the end of more than 4 or 5 rounds, tops? Anyone?

This is where you are wrong. You have to score on the clean punches landed because if you score on "the guy who has the worse damage on his face" Israel Vasquez would virtually never win a fight. Paulie Malignaggi wouldn't either because he can't put any facial damage on the other guy.

Blocking and dodging are just as part of boxing as agression is. You don't give the winner of a hockey game who has more shots on goal. You score the person who is leading in goals.

Cotto was landing the cleaner shots and therefore should be awarded rounds. It's not like the card mattered anyway, but 96-94 isn't that bad.

[Goodfella2279]

I had Cotto up by like 2 rounds going into the 11th. I thought, as I stated in another post, that Cotto won a lot of the early rounds with his combinations and clean, effective punching. Even though the punches didn't necessarily hurt Margo (you can hit him with a brick to the face and Margarito would smile at you and not move) they were hard shots that landed clean, which to me are scoring blows. Margarito started to win a good portion of the later rounds whien it became evident that Cotto was slowing down. I gave the 10th to Margarito because he rocked Cotto badly at the end. But it was a very highly contested, even fight. It was the type of fight that makes me glad I'm a boxing fan.