SIM style and how it relates to your game

[dafranchz]

I have noticed that when I go into "PRO 1" and play regular, my style and prowess had changed dramatically. I have to say (and thx to NUX19) that the "SIM" style has allowed me to hone my game. I am able to get on the people who like to leave their "creative genes" dormant.

To the rest of the bonafide "SIM" players, what is your take?

[Oilerfan]

Offensively, there really isn't a ton of skill being demonstrated. It's basically throw the puck to the net and hope for the best. Sure, you can work to get better shots, but the super goalies will still stop 99% of them anyway. Realistic? Yes. Skillful? No. Defensive play, on the other hand, is much more reflective on your skill level.

[TLTypeS]

the only way i see sim style of play as helping your "skill" is that if you play without one timers and more passing and trying to create opportunities... it helps a little when you play regular games with excessive one timers because u see more chances develop by being patient... dont kno if that sounds right but u should kno what im talkin about

[Warden]

What does "better all-around player" means?

Once again there are sportsmanship and there are skill.

Sometime skilled player is a bad sport and sometime good sport is not skilled enough.

SIM pushes you more toward "good sportsmanship" and away from "skilled".
If you interested I can explain more.

[dafranchz]

What does "better all-around player" means?

Overall skills and ability...thought it was a pretty obvious statement or term.

Once again there are sportsmanship and there are skill.

True but talking about skills. Sportsmanship was not mentioned. That will be the next poll :lol:

Sometime skilled player is a bad sport and sometime good sport is not skilled enough.

Too much poor attitudes around lately.

SIM pushes you more toward "good sportsmanship" and away from "skilled".

That is what I was getting towards. Maybe I jumbled my words. I feel that playing at both ends of the specturm, has added to my overall game. Meaning, before playing a more "SIM" approach (at times), I was more reluctant to go for easy goals. Honestly, one-timers are a part of the game. Playing "SIM" has given me more options and it appears to be working for me. That's all. Just wondering if others were experiencing the same thing with the blend of both styles.

[nux19]

honsetly I never thought of it like that.

SIM- You WILL lose. No ifs or buts, outplayed or not.

ARCADE- a good player will win 90% of his games.

but overall hockey? I say a SIM player understands how the D is suppose to set up. That is the biggest difference.

[Warden]

I just can reapeat my self once again.

Real SKILL - when you can play and WIN against your opponent on ANY speed, with ANY settings and ANY gameplay/gamestyle.

If you good SIM player it doesnt mean you got no skill. But it is most likely that your skill is useless on speed 10.

You can be an arcade BEST player on speed 10. But your skill may not pay off on speed 0.

I am talking about videogame ESPN NHL Hockey. Game got 10 speeds and tons of options. And you can call your self SKILLED at this game only if you can equaly play and WIN on ANY speeds/settings.

I never said "SIM - no skill/Arcade - all skilled."

But if you match-up 2 players one playing sim style only and oneplaying arcade - I think almost all people will agree that Arcade person will dominate games on speeds 4-10.
And only speeds 0-3 will give chanse to SIM player.

[dafranchz]

But if you match-up 2 players one playing sim style only and oneplaying arcade - I think almost all people will agree that Arcade person will dominate games on speeds 4-10.

And only speeds 0-3 will give chanse to SIM player.

Not necessarily true...it's all about adaptation. I play well at both ends. Give me those Arcaders :o

I'm a blend player...a hybrid! hahaha :wink:

[Warden]

match up was based on theory that SIM player never play arcade and arcade player never play sim.

If you mix all this and play equaly often using both styles - than its the one big step to become a good player. You can easy adjust to any speed and style.

[nickels]

My take on Arcade vs Sim is that mostly Arcade=Cheese.

High speed games always have players that do the same move a million times, try to score on game flaws. Usually these are the players that remove line changes and offsides and have the penalty slider lowered. These are people that are good knowing what to do to score on ESPN hockey, but they will need to start over and learn the new tricks again in 2k5.

Slow games tend to make people play more like real hockey...setting up plays and earning goals. These players do not try the x-y-z approach to scoring.

Fast game lovers always seem to try the scripted scoring moves:
1. S move (which I am fine with cause you can defend it)
2. Cross crease shot
3. P.O.T. One-timers over and over

I find that I can adapt and play at high speeds, but that becomes a game of who is better at pulling of the scripted moves. I have yet to play someone in a fast (Gamespeed of >5 and pens >5) sim game.

[dafranchz]

Nicely put Nickels

[Warden]

Once again , I strongly disagree with people who think that its OK to call arcade minded people "Cheese".

Developers included in videogame speed 10, no line change option , no offsides option and have the penalty slider to put it low or high.

Developers put it in game for a reason right? Cause people got right to play the way they want. They paid 50$ and they want pure goal fest. SO WHAT? Why we judge them? Why we call 'em "cheese"?

Yes, they exploiting the game flaws, yes they want to use one strong line - so be it. If you know how they gonna score than do your best to defend against it.

Like it or not but to call someone "cheese" or "loser" or "cheap" just cause he having fun his own way - immature in my opinion.

[dafranchz]

Once again , I strongly disagree with people who think that its OK to call arcade minded people "Cheese".

Developers included in videogame speed 10, no line change option , no offsides option and have the penalty slider to put it low or high.

Developers put it in game for a reason right? Cause people got right to play the way they want. They paid 50$ and they want pure goal fest. SO WHAT? Why we judge them? Why we call 'em "cheese"?

Yes, they exploiting the game flaws, yes they want to use one strong line - so be it. If you know how they gonna score than do your best to defend against it.

Like it or not but to call someone "cheese" or "loser" or "cheap" just cause he having fun his own way - immature in my opinion.

Another conservative for ya! Let it go Warden, let it go....

[Warden]

I cant. I see it all the time here. If someone doesnt play the way you play - he is a "loser" or "cheese" at minimum.

I see it as one of the biggest problems in online gaming.

You know what cheese in my understanding? Its when 2 SIM players playing whole game nice and clean 'sim' style - got tie 2-2 - and one of players pulls money goal to win a game. THAT you can call "cheese". When both agreed (verbaly or mutualy) to play by the "rules" and someone pulled s-move for example....

[nickels]

Actually I said "cheese" then explained what was cheesey about it.

Warden, do you just like to argue or what:
Yes, they exploiting the game flaws...

So exploiting game flaws isn't cheesy?
Whatever :roll:
I see it as one of the biggest problems in online gaming.
WRONG - The biggest problem with online gaming is all the cheaters!

Just ask any Socom player who got to get killed by the invisible people exploiting the games flaws...I guess they were just not into playing SIM Socom.

[Warden]

You gotta understand and (more important) accept that not all people see this game as you and I see it.

Not for all people this game is SIMULATOR. They dont see it as flaws. They see it as a easy way to score a goal to win a game. Which is fun for those people. They pay same money as we did and got all right to enjoy this game the way they want.

Yes in our sim mind its a flaw and its cheese, but for them it just a fun and easy way to play this videogame. But just cause we "think" its cheese we cant go and flame 'em. Not on official ESPN Videogames forums at least. This forum is for all: SIM and arcade players.

I dont like argue, but I want to explain my point of view as clear as possible.

[isarpsd]

I think everyone's missing the point of this poll.

The question is whether or not playing the "sim" style for any length of time improves your overall game. That means, if you limit your game for a period of game and play "sim," then suddenly take away those restrictions and go back to playing a more free game (perhaps not as realistic or sim, but that's not the point)...will you be better than you were at first?

I think the answer is yes. Part of the foundation of playing "sim" is using a variety of scoring methods. It's easy to win games using the same method of scoring over and over (example, DaLeafs)...however, if someone knows how to stop that scoring method, then you are screwed. If you play "sim" for whatever length of time, you are probably learning new methods of scoring that work similarly well. Then, if you go back and play a non-"sim" game, you have multiple weapons at your disposal. You can now solidly own any opponent, provided they aren't extremely good defensively.

Now, I'm not saying that playing "sim" for some length of time is the only way to improve your overall game. I'm just saying that it does improve your game.

[dafranchz]

I think everyone's missing the point of this poll.

The question is whether or not playing the "sim" style for any length of time improves your overall game. That means, if you limit your game for a period of game and play "sim," then suddenly take away those restrictions and go back to playing a more free game (perhaps not as realistic or sim, but that's not the point)...will you be better than you were at first?

I think the answer is yes. Part of the foundation of playing "sim" is using a variety of scoring methods. It's easy to win games using the same method of scoring over and over (example, DaLeafs)...however, if someone knows how to stop that scoring method, then you are screwed. If you play "sim" for whatever length of time, you are probably learning new methods of scoring that work similarly well. Then, if you go back and play a non-"sim" game, you have multiple weapons at your disposal. You can now solidly own any opponent, provided they aren't extremely good defensively.

Now, I'm not saying that playing "sim" for some length of time is the only way to improve your overall game. I'm just saying that it does improve your game.

Thanks isarpsd..that was the point I was trying to get at.

Warden, I understand all your points and views. Quite honestly, I am not questioning what is and what is not "cheese." I play opponents from game to game. What I was trying to relate, was that the fact I increased my ability overall while participating in "sim" games. I can probably be backed when I say only about 98% of the online players perfer "sim."

I know it is not for everyone, but isarpsd summed it all up. That's all I wanted to know.

[Oilerfan]

If you guys find a decent way to score without using one timers, i'd sure like to hear about it.

[Warden]

The slower the speed, the easier it is to play defense. The higher the speed, the easier it is to score.

Low speeds and certain rules make it easy for sim player to defend. You know that opponent will not score certain goals and you simply dont pay attention to it.

I remember it was Gamertag Forsberg (also known as 74) back in 2k3, he entered speed 5 tournament after playing SIM games for a while. He got crashed 5-0 and quit game in the middle of period. Can I say that SIM make him better ? Even in sportsmanship?
I remember some other people that are very good SIM players on Live but when they try to play in All-GOES games they just getting killed and drop from leagues or tourneys..

I am SIM player. At least I like to think it about my self. And I think that if you play SIM style only without equal ammount of arcade games your OVERALL skill goes down.

I understand that its hard for some SIM players to admit that they overall skill goes down.....

Does sim makes you better all-around? If you talking about sportsmanship - yes it does.. If you talking about OVERALL GAME SKILL - no it doesnt.

[Mondo]

I'm with OilerFan on this one. I don't see how the best sim player can have a dominating record when I'm sure there will be dry spells of goal scoring, as hard as you guys make it to score. Do all you sim guys have sub 500 records?

[dafranchz]

Do all you sim guys have sub 500 records?

I don't! But then again...I haven't been playing that much because of work.

[gramb0]

You playin SIM is fine but is the computer goalie going to play SIM too? Then why torture yourself 6000 overtimes untill somone lets a wrist shot go from the red line and it goes in but what ever floats your boat :)

[nux19]

mondo, i was over .500. Something like 144-44 playing SIM style, WITH 1-T but no S. Im 5-2 right now playing with very limited 1-T, so don't doubt that a SIM player can not win. But yeah, there are def. streaks where its hard to win ie my rookie record right now.

grambo goalies do play SIM (or SIM enough with some rules) on rookie. On Pro w/o 1-T it is hard, but with 1-T it gets a little too easy.

[gramb0]

The problem w/ 1-timers is it screws u out of the ones that should get so you get mad and you have to get a 1-timer or the controllers life is in danger w/ my cement walls